Shyfer @ Shyfer @ttrpg.network

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2 yr. ago

By your logic should we ban all the Zionists in Lemmy.world denying all the dead Palestinians and calling them Hamas. Because there's a lot. The point is, these things become extremely subjective.

EDIT: Just saw that some people said the invasion of Poland was bloodless. Those kinds of comments do sound like straight up misinformation, though, so it's not all subjective lol.

What was wrong with the post specifically? It all looks true and sourced to me. A non aggression pact is not the same as being allies with the Nazis unless you think Sweden, Switzerland, and the US were allied with the Nazis, too, for a time. The USSR needed time to build up their forces and get a buffer zone since the people they wanted to ally with refused to fight the enemy they were scared of, an enemy they had to prepare for.

Thanks for your even handed analysis btw. I think this analysis seems fair.

Well, it does target Trump, too. None of these people say they are going to vote for Trump, either. So by the same logic, they are helping Biden win, too.
Besides, it makes perfect sense you hear Biden's name more than Trump's. It's not as much of a threat, because there's nothing Trump can do right now to get those votes, because he has no power. Pressuring him wouldn't help Palestinians right now, before the genocide and ethnic cleansing is complete. With Biden it would. Plus, Trump is clearly trying to get the Zionist vote, leaving no one to get the non-Zionist votes. Biden has the most potential to be that candidate if he is as push-able to the left as people told me was he during the 2020 election. And he has been surprisingly malleable in some matters, so I think it's possible. They just have to believe those votes can be lost, instead of going towards the Democratic Party because they have nowhere else to go and thus they deserve to get them even without doing anything for those constituents.

They're not causing distrust, they're pushing for change. I think the problem is the people on the other side. If everyone hand wringing worried about Biden's chances vs Trump instead pressured Biden, too, instead of trying to do some moral arithmetic in their head, I guarantee Biden would feel forced to change tactics and go harder on Israel, and we could get actual help for those poor people faster. Then we could all vote for Biden without feeling bad about it.

The single biggest thing Israel has going for it is their support from the US, including their veto in the security council, help with weapons and money, the iron dome, shared technology, they're trying to make bills making it illegal to criticize Israel or protest universities against our First Amendment, they're warring in Yemen for this cause, and now they're trying to interfere in the ICC case and investigation process, too. So while I do agree there are other ways to help, such as the BDS movement, spreading the word of Israel's history, there are streamers who have volunteered to help refugees and stuff, I still think that getting the US to stop supporting Israel politically would be the biggest way to help Palestinians. And that requires change from the top.

Plus, it's just insane another sovereign nation gets that much unconditional support from our politicians, while we don't even have universal health care lol.

New Non-Woke Freedom Shirts! Get your Non-Woke Freedom Shirts!

It looks so easy 😭 I wish I had the starting capital and lack of morals to start one of these grifts.

It's better than doing nothing when tens of thousands of people are dying and a genocide is happening. Unless people are rich, the ballot and protests are all people have, and they're trying to make protests illegal. I don't think Palestinians and their friends or families would agree it's illogical when people demand to do everything to save them, and the idea of solidarity is that you'd want them to do the same for you when they start targeting your group for a genocide. That's the whole idea of "Never again." Or like Captain America's line, "We don't trade lives." Of course Trump is bad, but on the other hand, if Biden is actually a good candidate, he'll shift with popular opinion to keep his job. We shouldn't have to choose between Hitler and Pol Pot, and if we're forced to, people shouldn't be surprised if voter turnout is depressed a bit.

A quick note about how this one is different from other massacres, because that's usually the next point (why do people care about this situation?) : Unfortunately, we can't do anything about most of the tragedies and genocides in the world, like the Rohinga or Uyghur, but the thing about this process is that 1) it's old-style settler colonialism process in the modern day and 2) it's directly enabled by the US and other imperialist countries, the place where a lot of these commenters live, so they can do something about it by pressuring their leaders and politicians, and starting popular movements to do the same.

Right? It seems repetitive.

People are doing it following the same models as earlier movements, like apartheid in South Africa. Protests at the universities demanding divestment, the BDS movement, pressuring with lost votes and the "no preference" vote, educating the public about the wrongs of settler colonialism, apartheid, and genocide in general and Israel history more specifically, reporters in Israel are doing their part (not the US propaganda ones), World Food Kitchen workers and other aid workers risking their lives being martyred, the and people pressuring to withhold their vote without a change in policy, too. He can easily recoup these votes by not aligning with Israel, so strategically its making the moral option the politically best option.

People have grandparents who can see the homes they had that Israel stole. It's not like the conflict has been around that long. There's no solution because Israel doesn't want a solution, they want all the land. They can sustain this uncompromising attitude because they have the support of other imperial powers like the US. Without its help and veto in the UN, Israel would be screwed. It's not as complicated as the conflict seems, it's part of Israel propaganda to make it seem more complicated than it is, to pretend it stretches back millions of years and not just to the 70's or the 40's.

Ya definitely don't want Trump to win either. Ideally Biden ends up deciding Israel isn't worth losing an election over, stops supporting them, and then crushes Trump with the same or more youth votes he got in 2020. Probably with the help of weed legislation, too, but not sure if the young people care about that as much as they used to when I was in the "youth" lol.

Tbh, I had always thought Tank Man was run over until extremely recently (like this year) so I'm sure there are lots of people like me who had just assumed that. I remember seeing a picture with red circles over all the supposedly dead bodies that had been run over by tanks. It's still an impressive image, a single man bravely stopping a tank, but not quite what I thought I was looking at.

It seems like if you'd take it's net impact throughout world history and it added it all up, you'd end up in the negatives. Like it's been actively more bad for the human race than good.

Or they're trying to pressure the acting President to change an immoral policy with the threat of lost votes so that he obeys his constituency like he's in a democracy. He's got plenty of time to change course and it's already caused him to make some small measures, like changing his rhetoric and pausing a weapon shipment once.

Right, but there have been settlers in West Bank. They're still Palestinians being harmed. And life in Gaza isn't sunshine and roses for most Palestinians, either.

And the slowly encroaching settler attacks, blockade, and occupation was just what? A special military operation?

And a lot of people don't want to compromise on genocide. I think that's pretty understandable.

You can't be in the left and support the status quo, especially if the status quo is leading to a genocide. Pro-genocide solidarity isn't acceptable. Sitting there and accepting it isn't acceptable.

Exploding heads, too, but everyone defederated from that.

Ya I had a friend just lose a license for 20+. These speeds are crazy.

It's called pressure to force him to make change. He's got plenty of time to not support a genocide before November.