1y ago

The ole switcharoo

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I think there's a higher probability that Russian soldiers would rape a female prisoner than there is for IDF soldiers to rape a prisoner. So that factors into people's feeling on this little "switcharoo" exercise.
It's not actually hypocrisy to have awareness of a military's track record in regards to sexually assaulting their prisoners.
There's also a significantly higher probability that Hamas would rape a female prisoner than basically anyone in the world.
But I suppose people who look the other way when their allies call for genocide, look the other way when they intentionally murder over a thousand people, they're probably also going to look the other way about them raping their prisoners too. I guess that's consistent and therefore not "hypocritical."
- Can I see the equation you're using to calculate these probabilities?
  
  I'm afraid you would have to look up his ass, where those probabilities were pulled from.
  
  If you're pretending to be ignorant of the rapes committed by the Russian military and the rapes committed by Hamas, then you're just someone that's only here to push narratives to support some fascist cause.
  
  You're the one here pushing the fascist israeli cause.
  
  Nah fam, Israel is a democracy. Meanwhile, there hasn't been an election in Gaza since Hamas took power.
  You see fascists often make efforts to de-legitimize democracies. Accuse the other side of that which you're guilty, right?
- How many thousands ~~civilians~~ oops, pardon, "terrorists" did IDF kill until now exactly? Not a single person in their right mind would complain if IDF targeted only terrorists. But at a certain point, when civilian casualties from the retaliation far outweigh the casualties from the initial attack we need to ask ourselves "What is even the point of this?"
  
  When the French Resistance attacked the Nazis during the occuption of France, the Nazis would at times go to a village and kill 10 random people for every German that had been killed.
  Israel has already passed the 20-to-1 ratio and counting. In fact the 10-to-1 ratio is just of the killed Palestinian children to killed Israelis. The previous bunch of Nazis didn't children in those they murdered as reprisal.
  
  Well the terrorists don't wear uniforms, do they?
  Which means that A) we can't know how many of the casualties are terrorists and B) the difficulty in identifying who's a terrorist and who's a civilian leads to greater civilian casualties.
  If the Hamas terrorists all wore uniforms (and maybe put civilians in their underground bunkers instead of their "brave" leaders) there would be far fewer civilian casualties. Did you ever consider the possibility that Hamas actually wants there to be more Palestinian civilian casualties because it makes people like you hate Israel?
  In most countries the military prioritizes protecting their civilian population. Do you really think Hamas is prioritizing protecting the civilian population of Gaza? If the government of a country doesn't prioritize protecting it's civilian population (and may actually want there to be civilian casualties since it helps their cause) shouldn't you expect there to be more civilian causalities than seen in other conflicts?
  How do you react when you see people cosplaying as actual genocidal terrorists at "Free Palestine" protests? Do you ever stop and think "are we the baddies?"
  
  Did anything I say imply I'm pro-Hamas? Or anti-Jewish? No, I clearly wrote that I'm anti-IDF and anti-Netanyahu government. The government that shortly before the war started was facing massive protests due to its authoritarian policies, and that is rumoured by Israeli citizen to be using the war to distract the public from its aforementioned scandals.
  You should also consider the fact that Israeli authorities propped up Hamas as a counterweight to PLO, which they feared would be able to successfully win Palestinian independence. And similarly to how Pakistan propped up the Taliban, now that the radical Islamists got into power, they begun conducting terror attacks on the territory of the country that helped them.
  "Do you ever stop to think 'Are we the baddies?'" says the person unironically supporting a government that calls its civilian victims "animals"
  
  Ah so you only hate the ~~cosmopolitian~~ zionist Jews then?
  And I see you're onboard with the "scheming Jews" narrative. So you're already on step 2 of the antisemitism treadmill.
  You probably also look the other way when your political allies talk openly of committing genocide on Jews. Just like the socialists in the National Socialist party right? You know what happened to those useful idiot socialists back then on the night of the long knives?
  You need to read a history book if you think that the purity of your ideology keeps you safe from your genocidal "friends".
- So what you're saying is that because terrorists did horrible things, IDF committing genocide is a-okay? Because Russians are worse, we should not heavily criticize the Israeli army and government?
  Great points to make!
  
  The war in Gaza is the most documented war in history. What you're seeing is war, not genocide. A war that was started by Hamas.
  In most wars you don't see the death and destruction it causes. The civilian deaths are just a number. Sudan, Yemen, Ukraine, etc. are just numbers to you so don't have the emotional impact that actually seeing it has. But civilian deaths are a byproduct of war.
  And once again Hamas started this war.
  What happened on October 7 was genocide. The attempt to kill as many people as possible of a particular ethnic group.
  There's indication that support for Hamas has increased after October 7 in the Palestinian population. Probably why they did it. Fascist movements need to create hatred to maintain power after all.
  I see you trying hard to "both sides" this, attempting to push a narrative that "Israel is just as bad as Hamas because they do genocide too" but that comes with the admission that Hamas is evil. So why are you allied with the evil genocidal maniacs in Hamas? Is it that when the genocide is against Jews it's acceptable to you?
  
  haven't you been around long enough to realize that this isn't a "pick one side" situation? surely you realize it goes far beyond oct 7 by now. because it really doesn't sound like you understand this at all.
  
  no. their screed indicates the lack the capacity for nuance or criticism of Israel or even introspection.
  cut bait.
  
  No but I've been around long enough to recognize the signs people are being coerced into a fascist cause, which is what the Free Palestine movement is.
  If the Palestinian movement was about non-violent resistance, then sure I'd be onboard with that. But it's the exact opposite of a non-violent resistance movement. You have people doing dog whistles like "from the River to the Sea." You have people cosplaying as Hamas genocidal terrorists at rallies. Synagogue are being attacked, Jewish businesses are being burned down with with "Free Palestine" spray painted on them. Hamas calls for protest and people show up to those protests. What little effort was made (there was barely any effort at all I could see) to separate the "Free Palestine" movement from Hamas has clearly failed.
  All of the fascist tactics are being used to further a cause which is ultimately about blood and soil.
  Everyone just looks the other way and makes excuses for obvious antisemitic behavior because they don't want to admit they're a part of a violent and genocidal movement. Nobody will even consider the question of "are we the baddies?" even when the person going to the same protest they are is calling for extermination of Jews.
  
  sounds like you could use a jump to conclusions mat.
  you talk like you are some expert who has access to incredibly specific and impossible data. in reality you've clearly picked the israeli side and don't care that they have slaughtered a ratio of 10 to 1, have reduced gaza to completely unlivable conditions and show no signs of stopping.
  who the fuck cares about whether protests are a mix of racists and not? how is that the thing to be focused on in this crisis? innocent human beings are being unreasonably killed. fuck right off trying to muddy up this issue to support that.
  
  A war started by Hamas
  An organisation formed in 1987 started a war in 1967? Did they utilise Delorean-propelled grenades?
  
  Do you actually think you're making a compelling argument by pretending to be incredibly stupid?
  "Durrrr.... what war are you talking about? I don't understand anything that's happening right now!"
  
  How is it stupid to understand that recent events are a continuation of a decades long conflict begun with the Six Day War of 1967?
  Anyone with a modicum of knowledge on the conflict in general would see that I threw you an easy pitch for the sake of a joke. If you had knowledge of the issue, rather than what news outlets deigned to tell you, you could have retorted by asking who initiated the Six Day War. You could have even made the very valid point that this whole conflict is all caused by British imperialism stemming from the Balfour Declaration of 1917, an act appeasement by the British Government brought about by decades of anti-semitism in British politics; this is my actual stance. The reason you did none of this is because all of these terms like Six Day War and Balfour Declaration are completely new to you, as you have no actual knowledge of the subject.
  
  How many people that Hamas is sending out to "martyr" themselves were even alive in 1967?
  It's a typical fascist tactic to make people upset about something that happened in a history book. The word fascist literally comes from Mussolini making a callback to the Roman Empire to make Italians upset over not ruling over lands that their long dead ancestors ruled over.
  Obviously I'm talking about the hostilities that began on October 7. But you just can't pass up an opportunity to spread grievances over some historical wrongs that happened before any of us were born.
  
  So 56 years is so long ago as to be ancient history that has no impact on the politics of today? Everyone involved in the conflict is less than 56 years old? Learn to actually form an argument, instead of calling fascist at the first opportunity, especially when you’re arguing on the side of Likud.
  It’s impossible to view the October attack in isolation when it is a direct consequence of the chain of events and continuous prolonged period of hostility described in my previous comment. Pull a different one.

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