What do you host for your finances and why!
Inspired by a comment on my last post.
I feel like I never have a solution that allows me to control it while also being automated to such a degree that I don’t have a huge confusing backup if I don’t do finances for days or weeks.
This won't help you, but I want to brag. I started using Quicken to track my finances at the turn of the century, back when it was all local storage. Quicken 2012 was the last iteration that used http (not https) to update stock prices. When they discontinued support, I captured the interaction and deciphered the formats. Wrote a proxy to intercept the request, look up the security info, and send back the data.
So, I self-host quicken.com. It's saved me having to update Quicken or submit to their subscription model.
That’s really cool! How did you do that?
Super easy, as it turns out. I run my own DNS and web servers, so I pointed quicken.com at my web server to capture the request, then used curl to capture the response. Both turned out to be plain ASCII, request like
stk.1=SMCI;.2=NVDA;.3=INTC;
as POST data, and responses like
qwin.quotes.ASTM.symbol 4 ASTM
.last 7 18.7400
.time 10 1573074000
.time.str 5 16:00
.change 6 0.4000
plus a whole slew of other optional fields for fundamentals, dividends, etc. It was a simpler time on the internet, when no one cared about leaking data and companies didn't care if a handful of geeks reversed engineered their data structures.
I use Actual. How it works is very similar to YNAB (you budget the money you currently have) but it's open source and privacy focused. I started using it a few months ago and I really like it so far!
I love Actual. So, so good. I cancelled YNAB in favor and can't ever think of going back. Aside from not having to pay $100 a year you're also not supporting the Mormon Church (YNAB is a Mormon-run company).
Actual Budget all the way
I switched over to Actual last month, and am not looking back. I will miss the native android app, but it is an otherwise direct replacement. I was using YNAB4, and had forever.
Is there some tutorial you'd recommend to get started? I didn't find the docs or demo helpful and a lot of videos seem to be focused on background or setup. I can install the app fine, but like how does one actually use this?
I've never used budgeting apps. I'd like to learn more about them and why they're useful. My current budgeting is: positive balance=good; negative balance=bad
As a note for people new to budgeting apps, YNAB has a toooonnn of tutorials and videos about how to create a budget and what the end-to-end workflow looks like in their apps.
They have an excelent documentation for new starters. https://actualbudget.org/docs/getting-started/roadmap-for-new-users
I have a excel sheet on my laptop
I have Firefly III and am really quiet happy with it. I might write a companion program to scan bill though, since doing everything by hand is rather time consuming.
I just drooled a little at the thought of integration with Paperless.
Is there a mobile app that syncs with self hosted?
Yes, but it's incompatible with the way I handle access control. I think I did it with Remote User authentication, which breaks all the login mechanisms of diverse apps, even though it's officially supported by the projects. That's why I only choose projects where the frontend is a PWA or they support oidc.
So I just installed the PWA, which works great.
Moneydance https://moneydance.com/
Started using it close to twenty years ago and keep using it because it seems fine.
Actual Budget, because it supports SimpleFIN to import my transactions.
It's still not "automated," but I have a lot of rules now so it's getting there.
I'm not super happy w/ how it works, but I'm too lazy to do anything about it. Maybe I'll end up adding SimpleFIN to something else, idk.
My bank does this for me, but I do like self hosting things. Where's the benefit in this apart from a fun project?
If you only have one Bank (Account) it is maybe fine.
But if you have multiple accounts (I have 4 Bank accounts for savings and another one for my shares), you would like to have one software/application to handle it. Like the one email client for your different email accounts.
Ah that makes sense. Right now I have one account, but it has multiple cards and pools of money under it (for lack of a better word).
So for me this is still easily managed, even with four bank accounts and about nine sub-pools under them collectively.
I guess I just got very lucky with the bank I've kinda stuck with just because it's what my mom got me over a decade ago.
Yup, I have a ridiculous amount (like 8? bank accounts and 15? credit cards), so having something that automatically pulls in transactions is nice.
That said, my main "bank" is a Fidelity brokerage, so I don't really need those other bank accounts to sync since they mostly exist for temporary transactions, such as Zelle and cash transactions (Fidelity doesn't support those) and transfers for bank account bonuses (I net a >$2k/year on that). And for credit cards, I mostly use 1-2 credit cards these days, the rest are mostly for signup bonuses.
So for me, the $1.50/month is totally worth it to keep track of all that nonsense. If I only had 3-4 accounts, I'd probably use something like GNUCash instead, but I have >20, and I will for the foreseeable future.
Indeed. My bank surely does this better than I could ever do. But if it's "for fun", then it's fine.
Yez, I will be trying it out for fun. It just looks cool.
I use hledger mostly because of the plain text format. I came from YNAB as well but I just hated how you couldn't easily undo changes or see when you made a change, etc. This is so easily to track changes and you can add comments explaining your reasoning around things and you can keep everything in source control so you have all the power of that as well. Not for everyone but if you're a programmer or just comfortable on the command line it's great.
Id love to find a #creditunion that supported #openbanking and offered API access to my data so I could easily download it and use it with Actual or FireflyIII. I think working with a credit union to build this feature would be a great open source project.
Gnucash books split for personal, joint, and business with a mysql backend. I wrote a read-only web frontend for wife and OTG access. Sadly no automation so I just stay on top of it.
I use GnuCash. I typically update every couple weeks up to a month. Beyond that it can be hard to remember what specific transactions were.
It's double ledger and I really like that it forces strict accounting. That sounds cumbersome but once you're set up (it may take some trial and error), for me my workflow is essentially:
It's not automated but my data always remains local, and I can use the Linux or android application. I don't bother daily tracking on my phone, else it might be cumbersome. I've never used any of the budget features, just tracking where my money comes and goes.
Weird question, but what does GnuCash do that you wouldn't get easily from excel? I haven't used any of these apps and wondering what I'm missing out on.
Under the hood its mostly tables and reports, so ultimately not much, if you were dedicated enough to using Excel to rebuild GnuCash's views. It's more streamlined than excel would be because you won't have to worry about implementation, overhead of adding a new account, etc. Some things like auto-recommending accounts during import (and import itself) could be arduous in excel if not supported natively. Split transactions could be a headache (think your paycheck, which might be split into 401k contributions, several taxes, money into your bank, etc).
But fully recreating it in excel when it already exists would be a headache. More than likely you will have a more limited view in Excel if you're just creating a handful of tables to represent all of your many accounts.
Actual budget with simple fin for bank links. Currently hosted on pikapods, will move to self hosting on prem at some point.
Firefly III
Amazing, really hit's the spot of fully featured but a tool and not a new system you need to learn
Actual has been working fine for me. Supports all the family’s banks and credit cards I import manually.
Since most budgeting tools I found didn't satisfy my need (no cloud, automatic categorization of transactions etc.) I tried to create my own tool to categorize my transactions using camt.053 and csv files which I downloaded from my banks. Got bugged down with the presentation via bokeh, so it was pretty crude.
I recently found beancount in combination with fava, which solved most of my problems I had with my own tool. And the good thing: I was able to re-use most of my 'auto-categorization' code with only small changes. Not sure how universal my importer is, but with a bit of python know-how it should be quite easy to create an importer for your specific bank export.
From my experience, the csvs I got from my bank was insufficient for automatic mapping, which is why I'm using camt.053 where possible. As the camt.053 is not very common in many countries you could go for OFX files.
I use ledger. I have not automated so much outside of autocomplete macros in my text editor, but it doesnt't take too much time and forces me to look over my spend, so I like it. I will eventually attempt to build some kind of Dash-application for visualisation of the output, but have only started on the parsers so far.
Ledger is awesome.
I like Maybe Finance. Perhaps a bit basic but it does the trick for me. And the interface is quite nice too. No automation or bank imports though so it probably won't fit your purposes perfectly.
I host my own Monero node
Not selfhost but I use Hibiscus https://www.willuhn.de/products/hibiscus/
I'm saying this as someone who used Mint for years due to how it integrated with banks so easily.
I'm currently using Money Manager EX, which is open source. I "self-host" the database file on my NAS, and simply open the file through MM EX' Windows program.
Since it's just a simple database (encrypted, of course), it's easy to back up.
Now, I lost the ability to automatically sync with my bank. This was a blessing in disguise, since it forced me to go over each transaction carefully.
Granted, Mint had me doing the same, but because I spent a lot of time removing duplicates and fixing errors in their sync system. LOL
MM Ex has been very easy to use, and I don't see a need to self-host the software itself.
We do excel roughly but invest our surplus.
I have a bunch of we scrapers that check for items on sale and for certain ones trigger purchase and others send me an alert.
GnuCash running locally on my PC. Had worked for me for about 25 years.
Same here but now struggling to keep on top of it. I wish there was a mobile solution that would just nicely integrate with selfhosted
I don't understand why isn't crypto banned yet.
Its a dumb drain on world resources and only facilitates of untraceable payments for drug sales and tax avoidance.
Because the rich people of the world are at the top of that pump and dump pyramid and stand to extract a lot of money from the suckers of the world.
What makes you say this
I'm old enough to know that governments should care about taxes and payment traceability.
This is what funds the social programs such as healthcare and education.
And if government doesn't give a fuck - there is only one explanation, it's beholden to the corporate overloads that want to capitalize on the crypto action - which is not in my best interests as a private citizen.
Also - all it does it raises energy prices for me and makes GPUs more expensive for me.
Why should I support that?
Fuck crypto and fuck the government that's doesn't do anything about it.
It's the only way to get to Capitalism 2.0.
Crypto cannot be banned. It can only be made illegal, if countries want to remove themselves from the digital currency revolution. The derivatives market is $730T. Stocks are about $110T. Real estate is around $380T. If you're concerned about the minuscule amount of illegal activities that occur within the 3.5T crypto market, your fears are misguided. Crypto is mostly traceable. Fiat currencies are highly preferred for drug sales and tax avoidance.