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  • I don’t understand how socialists and communists can still believe they can build a mass movement in the imperial core? What gives you this much hope? Cause in my experience these people want me dead and if they have to be killed for a socialist future then let it happen

    Edit: im not saying this out of Condescension im speaking out of curiosity and frustration

    • I align with your pessimism.

      The fact is, in the U.S especially- you are either a reactionary or you're left adjacent and too comfortable with your imperialism dividends to make the required sacrifices needed for a mass movement.

      I think this is why even some self described MLs advocate for electoral solutions, it's the easy way out.

      Fascism must be allowed to rise and fall in the, U.S americans must go through a revolutionary crisis- it's the only needle that can penetrate the balloon of american hubris. The last century has proven this, yet we're told to prolong the inevitable and necessary with soc dem elections / dead-end - non-militant organizing.

      Trump, his cronies, and the tech twats have done more to put the U.S and much of the left into a positive position than many of the civil-centric organizing left adjacent people have ever done. People want to talk about material interests driving class consciousness and political fervor- well those are the people driving the needed material conditions.

    • The question is not what is wrong with the imperial core but what is wrong with the left of the imperial core. Reactionary societies are the result of a weak, opportunist-riddled and idealistic left.

    • just because it hasn't been done it doesn't mean it can't be done. i hate western leftists as much as the next guy but it's worse to completely disregard anyone from the imperial core.

    • The United States is a prison house of nations. There in lies the potential for a revolutionary alliance between the multinational working class and the oppressed nationalities (black and brown people across class).

      The Anglo petite bourgeoisie (small capitalists + intelligentsia) due to their class position are never going to be able to lead the movement and take it where it needs to go.

      I have more faith in the Anglo working class and the black and brown petite bourgeoisie, these people feel the hot coals on their feet and have a material stake in ending all exploitation.

    • I really can't understand where this concept comes from because I've been up and down the East coast of the US and I've talked with a lot of different communities. I've found more listening ears and sympathetic people in the hoods, rural communities, impoverished suburbs, etc.

      Is there reactionaries? Yes, of course, but the amount who actually want to harm people vs the amount who are relatively good, have no idea about politics, or are willing to hear out your side is vastly stark. Arguably 30/70, or even 50/50 if we are being vague. It also depends on where you go, I've found far more enemies in the gentrified downtowns of blue states than I have heavily mixed rural southern towns. Same with the mostly liberal colleges vs the impoverished suburbs.

      The big thing is so many get caught up in the frequency illusion, especially with social media. The loudest and most annoying reactionaries online say the most insane shit because they feel untouchable and like they can get away with it, but that doesn't automatically translate to irl daily life. Those loud mfs are loud for a reason, they compensate for their lack by functioning off bias & anger and only invite the unhinged like them. Most people are not that invested, often because they have too much going on in their own lives or rely on establishment beliefs, or even no beliefs because they're disillusioned by the system and checked out of it all (which is a large chunk of the US rn).

      America may have its higher than usual amount of reactionaries, but that's because we are a safe haven for them. At the end of the day there is far more potential allies than there is enemies and giving into the political nihilism and doomerism that "everyone is bad" is simply suicidal and unrealistic.

    • Honestly? Some of us were unfortunate enough to be born in the core (though I'm from what If consider a vassal state), so the hoping for and working towards a mass movement is the best we can do. Even if it's unrealistic, we have to work towards something. The alternative is to succumb to defeatism, and just wait for the inevitable fall. So we work towards a better tomorrow, because the alternative isn't viable.

      At least that's how I see it, and I'm mostly using your post to try and figure out my own stance on this. So take my blurb for what it is, a nonsensical flow of thoughts.

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