I'm worried that in the future we will be forced to use smartphones just like in China

You're not forced to use smartphones. I happen to live in China, and there are people without them.

You can buy tickets at the counter or vending machines, you can text or call instead of sending wechat messages, you can pay bills by card or direct debit, and supermarkets all accept cards (Chinese ones, that is) or cash.

People use wechat or alipay out of convenience. Just like people in the West use whatsapp, signal, fb messenger, telegram or whatever else there is. And some of those are testing payment service integrations (whatsapp pay for example is live in India since a few months ago).

You don't like it - don't use it. Nobody will force you. But if it takes me 7 seconds on my phone to finish a task vs. 2h in person, guess which one I'm choosing.

Edit: Typo

The thing that is bothering me right now is seeing “cashless” establishments. Frankly, it’s kind of discriminatory, and I do not know how you can justify denying people goods and services if they are carrying the currency of the country they live in. That does not sit right with me.

My kid's school just implemented an app-based pickup process this year.

You have to download an app and register your phone and email and child, then when you get in the line to pickup your child you have to press a button in the app.

I literally cannot retrieve my child from school without a smartphone.

Something happened in QC a few weeks ago like this. A IIRC 60yo person who donated blood all his life, went to a donor center, there was a lot of empty seats so he wanted to do like he has done for 40 years, take a seat and give blood, but no, nurses told him he has to register and make an appointment on the application. So he left.

I'm the opposite; coming from a more digital society my worry isn't that we'll all use smartphones, but that people don't have access to digital initiatives and will be left behind. I also am concerned with how some things don't have more regulatory oversight.

In short, smartphones good, unregulated big tech, bad. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I mean, you already do. Everything is digital, and most stuff is centralised anyhow (payment is controlled by a duopoly, Visa and Mastercard, and you gotta pay almost everything with them)

I honestly think the US is at that point. I need a phone to clock in, you can't find price checkers anymore, physically paying bills just doesn't happen anymore, checks are becoming obsolete. Stores are downsizing in favor of online markets, banks are closing lobbies in favor of digital. We love in a digital world and while it's technically possible without it still, very difficult to do so.

I hate the future and I hate "progress".

Cool, so get off the internet and quit annoying the rest of us.

Take it from the lens of the average Chinese person, and they will tell you it's awesome, simple and convenient. Pros and cons basically.

Try and access your US tax records online without a contract cell phone and see how far you get.

My go to answer is to say that I don't have a mobile phone. Actually, I have one, but it's only for personal contacts, not for institutions. When a clerk asks me for my phone number, I answer: sure, give me your phone number, I'll text you my contact.

Same for administrations and my employer: my boss has my phone numbers but not HR in my company.

The only institution that has my phone number is my bank, and i'm seriously considering using an alternate authentication method for 2FA at my bank.

If enough of us do that, it won't happen.

Maybe we should step away from China for a moment given their government has a very strong motivation to keep tabs on its citizens and the fact their very mention is biasing the conversation and look at another country which has a strong smartphone presence and I often see posted on here as an example of privacy - Norway

We're effectively cashless (I don't think I've even handled cash since they swapped the banknotes over) and I think most people do their banking from bills to petty transfers on their phone. You can't get a physical bus card, because that's on your phone, or the ticket is attached to your bank card. We don't have an all encompassing WeChat or even like, any homegrown social media. I'm not exactly sure which aspect of WeChat you're honing in on so I can't say Norway does that too, but we do an awful lot via our phones. I do have some gripes about how some things are set up, but they're complaints that aren't actually exclusive to this specific system.

Elon is working on replicating it now with “X”. He’s already said he wanted something like that for the US

This will happen and marginalized groups like illegal immigrants, the homeless, and the disabled will be effectively excluded. Poor people are going to have their finances controlled even more. This will cause deaths.

Permanently Deleted

You can't even open a bank account without a smartphone in China

Push for mobile phones that have open source operating systems like GrapheneOS. It'll probably be the most secure and private device you'll ever own. Then the issue is making these proprietary systems like WeChat, Google Services, whatever China uses. These should be accessible, and if it's required for day-to-day life then you're entitled to know every line of code you're forced to rely on.

I only use cash at the pot store.

Read Super Sad True Love Story

Do you hate all progress or just smartphone progress?

Because I could rattle off a list that would take a day to get through with all the progress that I love.

It's unironically good that there is further centralisation, integration and efficiency in payments, reservations, bills. What China is doing is It's progress and future. You just can't imagine that anything big and centralised can even in principle work for the people. WELL IT CAN AND IT SHOULD. No need to be a Luddite or dogmatic libertarian about it. What you are really worried that government or big corporation would control it. And if you are one of those that can't process the idea that government could ever be trusted in anything, because of bad experience (and probably partly because of propaganda) then it gets to be understandable position, but it isn't in reality like that and doesn't have to be like that.

Cash and other physical payment methods (Gold, silver, Goldbacks) are important. Same goes with email instead of phone numbers since email can essentially be free while phone numbers cost money to be registered and email is easily accessible on a computer and does not require a phone.

What a dingus.

Who doesn’t own a smart phone tho?

False.

Smartphones are not a tool to manipulate and spy on tge population. Nor are they a tool utilized by the ruling class to control the masses.

Dont assume that what happens in China will happen elsewhere.

You might appreciate the work done by purism to give us more control over our devices.