8 mo. ago • 98%

Finland detects more GPS jammers as drivers increasingly try to hide their tracks | Yle News | Yle

yle.fi Finland detects more GPS jammers as drivers increasingly try to hide their tracks

Owning a GPS jammer is in itself not illegal, but using the devices to interfere with signals is a crime, according to the Southeastern Finland Police Department.

66 comments

If only all these tracking functions were easy to deactivate (or better, opt-in) then there would not be a need for jammers

177
- They should 100% be opt in. If I want to use GPS I’ll use my phone. I don’t know a single person that uses the one built into the car.
  
  But obviously they want all that juicy data. It’s not enough that they charge insane rates on the vehicles themselves, they must also add microtransactions and track when we have sex, and with who too.
  
  127
  
  everything like this should be Opt-In.
  
  It should be a violation of our basic civil and human rights for this shit to be opt-out, especially in such a way that you are not even aware of it, or the ability to opt out.
  
  33
- I would say depends. For company owned cars thats justified as it should purely meant for business trip only. For duel use vehicle, that there should absolutely have switch to turn it on or off.
  
  9
  
  If they’re company owned cars, the company would be the one determining whether or not to opt in.
  
  1
So they should also make it legal to rip that shit out or force the automakers to give customers that option.

108
- The article is talking about lorry drivers making trips for work though. I am not sure I understand the need for the drivers to conceal their location while they work?
  
  But otherwise I agree.
  
  67
  
  Potentially to skirt driving time limits?
  
  Many lorry drivers are paid by the trip. If they get stuck in traffic, they are losing money. They are also required to take regular breaks, to avoid fatigue. If they jammed the GPS, then the company can't prove they didn't take their break, and worked through, to make up time.
  
  It also allows for disallowed detours. "Sorry boss, I was stuck in traffic for over an hour". In fact they went for a pub lunch, on the clock.
  
  51
  
  Hm yeah in a working context its different, but still, why would they need to be tracked, other then MAYBE logistics (which lorry drivers would be), so yeah, gets muddy
  
  5
  
  Permanently Deleted
  
  4
- This article centers on those driving work vehicles that their employer has installed trackers on. I know recently auto makers have been found snooping, which I don't even have words for, but this isn't that.
  
  23
  
  Yeah, looks like I misinterpreted a bit
  
  6
You know what feels wrong? You can easily buy GPS tracking devices on Amazon, but it is illegal to use a GPS jammer in USA, Canada and many other countries.

So companies spying you is fine, but blocking a GPS signal to prevent them from spying can get you a $16,000 fine.

Edit: my thought experiment is not about truck drivers being monitored but more about those fancy new EVs that sell your GPS based data to data brokers... You usually can't turn off the GPS in those EVs.

86
- The reason this needs to be illegal is because jamming the signal is not specific to you. You block your signal but you probably will also be blocking it for anyone else in the vicinity. Plus the way these things work they can create interference for other types of signals as well. It isn't the blocking itself that's illegal, but the interference that you're causing.
  
  71
  
  I totally understand this and I agree when it comes to jammers this powerful.
  
  My comment was about the low power models which only works for few feet, just enough for to cover your own car. Those are still illegal.
  
  7
- I'm no GPSjamologist, but if a jammer was running in your car, wouldn't the signal reach other nearby cars while in traffic or does it do it all within the confines of your automobile?
  
  38
  
  That is exactly why this is illegal. These things can have a range of up to hundreds of meters and thus you're affecting other people aswell and not just yourself.
  
  43
  
  This person jamologises GPSs on the regular.
  
  And yes, I doubt any county would fine you for jamming completely exclusivity (and exactly) only your antenna. It wouldn't even be detectable.
  
  8
- Active jamming is illegal but passive is not. You can block yourself but not others. FYI.
  
  35
  
  Tape some foil over the GPS antenna.
  
  5
- It's not just EVs - most new cars have these tracking devices where they sell your data to your insurance company to be used against you.
  
  23
  
  How are they getting the data?
  
  3
- Just wait until your smart toilet can tell the insurance companies what chemical substances you've consumed so that the can raise your rates, deny your claims, or sell the info to your boss so the company can fire you with cause.
  
  We already live in hell and there's no upper limit on the thermostat.
  
  15
  
  We already live in hell and there's no upper limit on the thermostat.
  
  Well actually there is because the smart thermostats are getting remotely limited by power companies sometimes.
  
  6
  
  I mean, I knew it was bad already, but please for the love of god stop giving them ideas that they may or may not have yet thought of...
  
  4
- Let me preface this by saying I completely agree that there’s a conflict here, but it’s pretty much required in this day and age.
  
  Let’s look at the current situation: Someone buys a tracker for under $100, sticks it to your car, and they can see you wherever you go. It’s scary, because they can know where you are at all times, and there’s no guarantee you’ll be able to figure out who did it.
  
  Now an alternative where GPS trackers are illegal: Someone buys the generic parts for a GPS tracker, sticks it to your car, and they can see you wherever you go. But also legitimate uses for GPS trackers aren’t possible any longer. Say goodbye to things like tiles and air tags, hell maybe even GPS in your phone since you can get an android device with GPS for less than $100 and load it with software to do the tracking. At best you’ve prevented easy tracking with a huge detriment to the average user, at worst you’ve outlawed GPS tech entirely.
  
  The final alternative is allowing jamming. I don’t have a nice story for this one, because the implications are far reaching. Is your jammer too strong? You’re interrupting other people’s GPS in a huge area, including things like navigation, child/pet/item tracking, time sensitive hardware could be using GPS as well, or things checking elevation. Not to mention, jammers can be used for nefarious purposes as well. Kidnapping a child and jamming a tracker on them, stealing a phone/wallet/keys and blocking its ability to report where it is.
  
  There’s no perfect situation here, but the current state is the least harmful to the general population.
  
  8
Vehicle telematics is the next frontier of the cyberpunk privacy dystopia. I hope more people start using these things.

58
- you make that comment, in a week where we have had a megacorp public assassination of a whistleblower and cypherpunk crypto money has risen to a record high value versus government money?
  
  6
46
- "There's only one nationality who would dare give us the raspberry! FINNS!"
  
  12
I would use one for privacy but there would be black vans following me around and probably land a felony. It is really easy to track these things. All they have to do is look for big blob of gps unavailable bubble moving around and they can also triangulate the signal with fairly cheap tools. Jamming is just spamming noise after all.

35
- Never fuck with the FCC (or relevant agency in your country)
  
  10
  
  Unless you're a big corp, then fuck with impunity but make sure to pay the "cost of doing business" tax.
  
  If the tax is too high, just buy some lobbyists or political system equivalent.
  
  11
- Yes and there was an article few months ago telling that burglars now use wifi jammers to turn off wifi security cameras before breaking and entering. Those jammers are pretty much illegal as well but criminal do illegal stuff anyways...
  
  That being said, how would blocking only the GPS help criminals in their criminal activities? I lack imagination I guess.
  
  6
  
  Your phone or car saying you were near the scene of a crime when it occurred. Your phone or car showing that you regularly cross paths with a person of interest. Jammer would keep those devices from rating you out.
  
  5
- There's why you buy a bunch and slap them on any car you can.
  
  1
Gonna start a business for car wraps with integrated faraday cages

19
- Until someone just sticks a transmitter on the outside of the wrap.
  
  6
- I think you could do it, but you'd need to spray some foam or something so the wrap cage isn't touching any metal of the car.
  
  Might be easier to just put a cage around the transmitter.
  
  5
  
  If you can find the transmitter, that is. I think that's the problem
  
  7
  
  That would also allow the driver and other occupants of the vehicle to use GPS, and their phones
  
  2
So professional drivers, watched by their employer, are using those to escape the control.

Even if they allow them to disable the GPS, it would be a reason for firing smb. Or to cut their wage since, drivers with GPS on will get a bonus if they are faster. Or sth shit like that.

9
- I have never seen smb short for somebody, and spent far too long reading that as "shake my butt" in the same connotation as smh
  
  9
  
  Sm ppl use way too many abbr.
  
  2
- It's illegal to spy on your workers through a camera in most EU countries. Why should GPS tracking be legal?
  
  7
  
  A camera and GPS are two very different technologies with distinct capabilities that do not overlap.
  
  16
  
  This is a safety thing. There are laws about how long you can drive without breaks because tired truckers kill people in accidents. They can't force a driver to actually rest when stopped, but if there's no law, then you know they'll never rest. I would agree if this was simply active monitoring of location on a company sedan, but it's different when the job is specifically driving for long periods
  
  6
  
  It can also tie into mandatary rests, that the vehicle has to be stationary. And that is good thing as it makes it harder for emplyers to exploit their drivers.
  
  5
  
  You are registering where your own vehicle is driven by an employee that should not be using it for personal things anyway. In contrast to his/her face, this is not registering anything personal about this employee.
  
  2
  
  Can you elaborate? Is it illegal to have security cameras in a business if that means that an employee may be on it?
  
  1
- Yeah the scam shouldn't last long. It should be easy to see if one of your drivers was jamming the GPS, and that would be cause to fire them.
  
  Were they otherwise good the employer is in a strong position to force the employee to comply
  
  2

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