Looking at you Verizon

ISP locking doesn't make any sense, why should they care if I use stock Android or GraphineOS?

119

Because the core reason is about control. They don't want users to have the option or freedom to install an OS of their choice because it could hurt their "precious" revenue

123
A lot of carrier phones come with carrier preinstalled apps. And it allows for sim locking, keeping you trapped with them or other carriers on the same network. Or at least that’s how it has been, back in the day, when sim-locking still was legal in the EU. Now, phones are the same, whether they come from your carrier or retail.

72
Their stated reason is to mitigate theft by preventing removal of software that binds the device to the network and account, and to protect their network by blocking paths to custom roms including potentially custom radio firmware.

The real reason is likely a blend of protecting leased devices for resale value, keeping people from removing "sponsored" apps or ones that make them money, and distrust of users ability to not get tricked into abject stupid choices.

32
- There's also ad blocking via the hosts file
  
  7
You don't think they care that you're attempting to circumvent their data collection on you?

24
They care because some users don’t actually own their phones and the carrier wants to keep strings attached, or they want to impose artificial software restrictions like preventing or limiting hotspot data.

Even when none of those conditions apply, you still often must deal with the locked boot loader. It’s BS.

4

This is why you never, ever, buy a phone from a carrier

110

The concept was always bizarre to me. It's like getting a PC as part of your broadband contract. Speaking of, it would make more sense to get a phone as part of your broadband contract, my phone is 95% an internet device. That it happens to have a SIM card in it is a minor feature.

39
- my phone is 95% an internet device. That it happens to have a SIM card in it is a minor feature.
  
  I seriously wonder how long carriers will keep handing out phone numbers to data-only devices. It has to be a serious cost for them to provision out so many numbers plus it only contributes to the phone number exhaustion problem that happens in many areas codes. For example my work has about 1000 training iPads we've shipped out, all with phone numbers local to our main office, purely for the purposes of connecting to mobile data. Any messaging/phone apps the Apple might proload are removed via the MDM so they really never use the phone number for anything. And I imagine the company I work for is not a minority in doing something like that given how cheap iPads are to deploy at scale for anything that just needs to run a web browser and nothing else
  
  8
Ok. Now how do I unlock my samsung note 20 ultra that isn't carrier locked?

9
- Also never ever by a Samsung phone. Seriously, you have to check in advance what you can and cannot do with your phone. Stop caring about megapixels, 15 cameras all around the edge of the phone and it being foldable 8 times or more. Then you can also buy phones under $1000. You should try it.
  
  10
- Assuming that model can be unlocked you'd usually enable developer options in Android settings, toggle the bootloader unlock option there then reboot to the bootloader and finish unlocking (and wiping) the phone.
  
  There's some Samsung fuckery requiring button presses and/or a cable plugged into the phone at the right time during boot to get into different bootloader modes, the exact buttons and cable plugging sequence vary by model so Google and see if you can find an XDA thread or something.
  
  5
Especially US carriers. Elsewhere, it varies.

8
Expensive, but worth it.

6
- Usually not even that bad, I buy a 1-2y old unlocked phone on fleabay for <= ~$400 when it's time for an upgrade and I'm set for 3y or so
  
  8
This and bootkits.

5

Buy a phone not tied to a carrier

48

Easy if you have money. If a new phone is a financial stretch, then in the short term it can be cheaper to get a nice phone for "free" with carrier lock in (which of course means it wasn't free at all). It probably ends up being more expensive in the long term, but your paycheck can cover it.

12
- You can actually get financing directly from Google who make the Pixel line of phones themselves, with bootloader unlocked as an option. So there is absolutely zero reason to buy from a carrier like Verizon unless they have a really fantastic promotion happening.
  
  8
- It is cheaper because you are the product. Maybe find something used.
  
  5
- brand new androids with the latest version go for about $150 ($90 with android 13 from last year); with them costing the same as 2 to 5 months of a carrier plan in the united states, it's hard to imagine them being a financial stretch
  
  1
That does not mean you will be able to unlock the boot loader. Unlocked carrier doesn't mean unlockecable boot loader. A lot of manufactures don't give you access to unlock it. US variants of Samsung phones are one example.

https://xdaforums.com/t/is-there-literally-no-way-to-unlock-the-bootloader-on-the-us-edition.4613667/

And on many phones, even if you can unlock the boot loader, there is a big chance that you will not have support by any major roms. There are only a handful of phone manufacturers that have easily unlockable boot loaders and are well supported by roms. Google, OnePlus, Motorola, and Huawei are the major ones that have good support because they make the boot loader unlocking easy.

6
- I agree but you can always just not buy as Samsung as those devices are trash anyway.
  
  0
Rather: only buy phones with explicit vendor guarantee that the bootloader can be unlocked / comes unlocked.

1

I've used all sorts of other ROM builds, lately I had been into LineageOS. Then I ran a stock Zenfone a while because I got sick of the never-ending treadmill of bootloader unlock>ROM>root>magisk etc etc

After 9 months with a stock phone I got a (used) Pixel and put GrapheneOS on it. From first boot it took all of 10 minutes to unlock the bootloader and install GrapheneOS. The longest part was the download. Bootloader re-locked. Easy peasy.

I'm a convert. I don't prefer the Pixel hardware, tho it's okay, but the ability to easily put my own OS on (and still use my banking apps) is pretty tits. I could revert to stock in 5 minutes.

42

People have told me not to try graphene because of the devs reputation, do you think it matters really?

7
- The dev apparently has the attitude of a cocky 14 year old when any of their decisions are criticized. Whether that's reason not to use the project is completely up to you.
  
  18
- I thought that was the Calyx developer?
  
  -1

first world countries have carrier locking illegal, and carriers sell the same configuration phones as regular shops.

27

Carrier locking != Bootloader unlocking

13
- carriers who must sell the same phone as an electronics retailer cannot stop you from unlocking the bootloader.
  
  -2
Welcome to capitalism...

For a long time VZW used separate tech. That required a different antenna/software. Hence special phones.

And still has some frequency bands not offered on international phones. But it is mostly about control.

11

You don't even need to get a phone from ISP or some telecom, on Xiaomi you need to install sussy app on PC and wait for a week, for unlocking bootloader.

27

Unless you are Chinese user, which means you are double fucked.

To unlock your phone, you need to:

Level 5 Xiaomi Forum Level (Gonna take half a year if you only check in daily, if you post and replies, then its tiny bit faster.)

Make an appointment for the Unlocking Permission Test (random dates, xiaomi is also slowly/quietly limiting the number of test dates)

Pass the test (timed, broad range/difficult technical questions, akin to a 300 level college exam that you're not given any materials to study for)

If you pass, you're only allow to unlock 3 phones per year.

But hey, if you bought the phone outside of China (or simply not Chinese version), then you don't have to do any of those except wait for 68 hours. Fuck the Chinese users eh (Chinese version also has a lot more bloatwares, the apps that you download from xiaomi app store also more invasive (more permission) than google play versions).
12
- What the fuck that's like a whole NPC quest line.
  
  10
I think it's 72h after linking your phone to your Xiaomi account, don't need their pc app abd tools work fine.

It's still one of the brands that are most open for custom roms since you'll retain your warranty unless you manage to do physical damage to the phone in the process.

11

I don't know what Verizons deal is with it honestly, but T-Mobile hasn't gotten in the way of it, they've even carrier unlocked phones for me that were still on a fresh payment plan for it.

Always best to buy directly from the OEM

Not everyone can afford that you know, and I find those budget/mid range phones insufferable. I'd buy one as a matter of last resort only.

25

I have a "budget" device from 2019. It runs Lineage OS and works fine.

Also you are the product

11
- Or buy a leading edge phone from 2-4 years ago, which is what I do. I can afford to keep hot spares around at those prices.
  
  10
I am more than aware that not everyone can afford buying high priced phones right out. I should have clarified that in my post

9
- I think what you did was OK. Meme doesn’t necessarily have to apply to everyone. In this case, you can say it was restricted to those who should have full control of their device with every expectation and for every reason, and it would still be valid and makes sense. But that’s just my opinion.
  
  8
When have you last used a mid range phone? It used to make a huge difference, but over the years, as phones matured, I feel it's shrunken down more and more. I used to always use flagships, but these days, I don't see what value they provide over 400-600€ phones in daily usage.

6
- 400-600€ phones
  
  That's like the price of the most expensive phone I ever owned, my old OnePlus 8T. I find budget phones insufferable these days, but midrange is generally fine provided you know what you're looking for.
  
  2
The best thing is actually to buy a used phone that was really good a couple years ago. I bought a used Oneplus 9 for $200 last year and it's still perfectly usable and way more powerful than I've ever needed a phone to be. Also older phones are more likely to be supported by third party android distributions.

4

Carriers still sell phones?

11

If you want to be on Verizon, check out Visible. Same network, but way cheaper. Bring your own device or use one of their cheap options.

8

While this is true, be aware there are drawbacks to 3rd party budget carriers.

The service includes caveats that your traffic lower priority then VZWs so if your on a busy node you may get throttled or temporarily kicked off

10
- I've been using a VMNO for 4 years now, never had an issue.
  
  I used to be Verizon only because of travel for work, and I need it to "just work". I've found NVMO to be no different now.
  
  It's possible in a specific area this could be the case though. Not all areas have the same coverage.
  
  8
- The $25/mo plan is unlimited GB but subject to throttling because it is not premium data.
  The $45/mo plan is 50 GB of premium data before you're subject to possible throttling on the rest unlimited GB.
  I hear that throttling is rare except large events, so I'm willing to risk it, I only use about 5 GB mobile data per month anyways.
  
  3
- Yup, my buddy has some Verizon budget deal. It works most of the time in our small ski town, but when the crowds swell on busy weekends, he may as well leave his phone at home.
  
  2
- I tried them for a month and had Kbps bandwidth consistently. This one is directly from Verizon I believe though. They use it to test things on their network like dropping 3g support.
  
  1

Truly so frustrating

2

I found this out when an old phone stopped getting updates, so I was gonna push a third-party OS, but no, even though it was a carrier unlocked MODEL, Verizon locked it and refuses to unlock it. So the phone is just gonna be out of date forever, I guess!

1

Use Swappa and never pay too much for your new old phone.

1