Valve Says Counter-Strike 2 for macOS Not Happening Because There Aren't Enough Players on Mac to Justify It
Valve Says Counter-Strike 2 for macOS Not Happening Because There Aren't Enough Players on Mac to Justify It
It's telling that Apple is trying to develop Proton-like tools for macOS, but even Valve, who are very actively developing them for Linux and have invested in porting software to macOS for years, are sort of giving up. Apple is so, so bad at working with game devs, it's amazing. I'm guessing they did their own thing internally and just published it instead of actually working with Valve and listening to the industry, as always.
46In terms of numbers (according to the Steamwide statistics, which may be different than CS:GO), MacOS isn't that far behind Linux in terms of usage. I get that Valve is pushing Linux and all, but this a bit scummy (saying this as a Linux user)...
Unless there is more Politics involved. My understanding (and I may be wrong) is that developing software for Apple is basically a quagmire of regulations, proprietary lockout and big pits you need to pour money into.
Also, strictly reading https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/73EF-08A3-0935-6369 they didn't say that they were discontinuing it BECAUSE of lack of playerbase, but that they didn't expect it to have much impact due to the small playerbase. Low player count is probably one reason, but I suspect there might be more factors in play.
EDIT: I know the article does mention the API issues, but I'm just a bit annoyed that they decided to title it the way they did for clickbait.
27They say at the end of the article that poor API support is likely influencing their decision as well.
24Permanently Deleted
8Valve's statement adds that players using DirectX 9, 32-bit operating systems or macOS "represented less than one percent of active CS:GO players". Dumping these platforms makes sense from that perspective, but it's a bitter pill to swallow for the Macintoshers amongst us or those who, for whatever reason, play on very old PCs.
from rock-paper-shotgun
4Your understanding is not quite correct. The regulations are for App Store apps only, which wouldn't affect CS2, and even if they did, they are not much different from other platforms' store regulations (no strong adult content, no gambling aides, no games that encourage you to damage peoples' hardware, you can't make games that would put private citizens' safety at risk, etc.). And the only money you have to pay is for a developer subscription, which gets you code signatures & anti-malware validation.
1
I'm all for games being as cross-platform as possible, but considering how Apple doesn't offer apps such as iMessage, Facetime, etc. on other platforms, I'm less sympathetic to them for this.
Apple users chose a famously closed ecosystem, so they shouldn't be surprised when some things aren't available to them.
23The issue here is that Counter Strike Global Offensive did have official Mac support. Then when CS2 came out, Valve replaced the CSGO client with CS2, rather than making it a new client, and then announced they're cutting Mac support. There is still a weird way to launch GO, but good luck finding players to play against now. It was pretty shitty of them to not leave GO as its own client or to not continue supporting Mac. This isn't quite a case of a new game not having Mac support, what happened from Mac users' point of view is their counter strike game updated and now they can't play it anymore.
13
They've made Linux gaming a thing. And there where no players there either. So I do not believe that is their actual reason.
The actual reason is that Valve does not want to be beholden or locked to a corporate entity like Apple or Microsoft. They would be very dependent on the whims of those companies.
Linux gives them a platform where they know and can influence it's future.
14I don't like this decision, since I know the lack of support for different platforms than Windows as someone playing on Linux. Valve invests into proton and thus game support on Steam Deck and ChromeOS, so I'd have thought they'd make sure CS runs on macOS too.
10Big difference I see from Linux and Windows is that they are OS that can be installed on different devices. MacOS is not the case, and even trying to get Linux to be stable and reliable on Apple hardware after the move to their own CPUs is a project in itself with Asahi Linux.
So I can see the lack of interest with how MacOS is a very restrictive Mac hardware only type experience for most people with how getting a hackintosh working is rather involved.
11I’d have thought the pain point would have been the processor architecture (ARM64) rather than operating system - MacOS still supports AMD64 using a compatibility layer but it would probably be quite a drawback to game performance.
7Not really, unless the game code was written in X86-64 assembly language, does low-level VM allocation for some reason, or otherwise has special dependencies on Intel CPU-isms. With a few exceptions, C/C++/Objective-C code written for X86-64 can be easily recompiled for ARM64.
The PowerPC to X86 transition was much rougher, because of the byte order change + PPC allowing integer division by zero while X86 disallowed it.
3
This is pretty fucking shitty. This would be fine if they didn't supplant CSGO entirely with CS2, but they did.
10Yeah they shouldn't have touched CS:GO on MacOS
5If it's any consolation, the Windows version runs on macOS Sonoma, but you need to use Whisky to install Windows Steam & launch it from there. Also, you need to adjust some graphics settings that can only be adjusted using the command line, or the frame rate will be unplayably bad.
I feared that CS2 would use some kernel-level anti-cheat solution, which would prevent it from running on macOS, but it doesn't.
5
Apple doesn't ship consumer systems with dedicated GPUs in them and they're on their own custom silicon now. Developing cross platform games for them must be a major PITA.
9The GPUs aren't really a problem; the M2 Pro/Max/Ultra chips are much more powerful than Intel's integrated GPUs, are very competitive with other mobile GPUs, and are competitive with all but the high end of desktop GPUs. The main thing holding them back is they consume less electricity, which is important in a laptop, but is not necessarily important in a desktop PC.
The problem is, game developers tend to pick the platforms that will make them the most money, and Microsoft has held an uncontested monopoly on the PC OS market for more than thirty years now. They have held onto their monopoly for so long because they have the high ground on GPUs (Apple has a grudge against Nvidia that probably won't go away until Tim Cook retires), and they also hold a number of popular games that are exclusive to Windows (Call of Duty, FIFA, Madden, Final Fantasy, Counter-Strike, Fortnite, Diablo, Far Cry) whereas Apple's highest profile exclusive macOS game at the moment is Hello Kitty.
It seems like each time Apple makes gains in the PC market (iPod/iPhone halo effect, keeping controversial UI changes to a minimum), Microsoft gains one and a half times that.
4
Valve has been using MoltenVK to run Dota2 on Mac1. I'm a bit worried that if Valve would cut the funding on MoltenVK2. Furthermore, CS:GO had been an example of a cross-platform example for multiple-player game. Valve's games may still support Linux/SteamOS, but what if other developers only release their games as win-only in future?
8Apple has been working on a proton like compatibility layer for Mac, hopefully this will enable cs2 soon.
5Good. I hope more developers follow suit cause maybe it might finally convince Apple to start selling PCs with proper GPUs in them again. It won't happen, but I can dream.
5I cant imagine apple cares all that much. They already gave up the PC gaming demo a long time ago while making quite a bit of money on mobile gaming.
3It's "good" that CS:GO was stripped away from Mac users and replaced by something unsupported because you don't like the hardware implementation? I don't follow, it"s
1
Mac users are a.... special breed
3