Gavin Newsom breaks with Democrats on trans athletes in sports
cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ca/post/40174373
California Gov. Gavin Newsom, a pioneer for LGBTQ+ rights who decades ago upset leaders in his own party when he defied state law and issued marriage licenses to same-sex couples, suggested Democrats were in the wrong in allowing transgender athletes to participate in female college and youth sports.
This is a topic that 99% of Dems don't give a shit about, but 99% of magats lose their mind over. Fucking sports.
Fuck you Gavin.
Regardless of where he is right on the transgender question (though to me this feels like it's more a cheap shot against trans people), this is yet more evidence that Newsom is a cynical opportunist who is only interested in grabbing power and influence. He's trying to position himself for a run at the Democrat nomination for 2028. He doesn't give a shit about people or issues, only votes and power.
And somehow he's managing to make himself disliked by both sides
He's the liberal DeSantis.
This is an issue that exposes some of the more dogmatic people in the movement.
It is as if there is a list of positions that you're required to believe and if you disagree with any one of them you're labeled a heretic (transphobic, in this case).
Sports and the fairness of competition is a complex issue even when you're just talking about cisgender competitors:
Can a person use performance enhancing drugs to train and then get clean enough to test positive for a competition? It seems unfair, to me, for the other competitors if this is the case.
It isn't an unfair statement to say that the physical performance of cisgender men is higher than that of cisgender women. This is why we have separate competitions for men and women.
The issue isn't as simple as a choice between "Transgender people should be free, without question, to compete in any competition" or "Transgender people should not be allowed to compete as their gender"
Framing it in such a black and white manner is harmful behavior, no matter which position you take.
We need to understand how people's bodies are affected and what advantages of disadvantages are obtained and then base the rule changes on objective data and not appeals to emotion or ideological bullying.
It is as if there is a list of positions that you're required to believe and if you disagree with any one of them you're labeled a heretic (transphobic, in this case).
This has been my biggest issue with a lot of people on the far left for a long time now. There is no room for anyone who might agree with 90% of their politics but disagree on one thing. In this case it's the transgender athletes topic. My own mother who is deeply left/blue/democrat has issues with this specific topic as well and she has seen just how inflexible people she believesd to be her own political allies can be about these things.
This isn't just an issue of the left (or of the right). It's a human weakness and we all suffer from it. It is very difficult to examine your beliefs individually and most people use this as a mental shortcut.
It becomes harmful when it scales up to an entire group or community where you have people (with power, like moderators) who enforce dogma through excommunication (banning) or social shaming (downvotes, dogpiling, cyberbullying, etc). This creates large groups of people who believe most of the things, but are also afraid to speak out on the other topics for fear of reprisal and social stigma.
That isn't healthy and it is up to every individual to speak out against dogma when they encounter it, especially when it is very unpopular to do so.
What I think is this is not a government issue. Whatever regulations are the ones that have rules against performance enhancing drugs in competitive sport are the only ones that should have any authority on this issue.
Do not make excuses for this nonsense being spouted by Gavin Newscom. You have no right to discriminate against trans women, intersex women and femme non-binary people.
Currently, there is no direct or consistent research suggesting transgender female individuals (or male individuals) have an athletic advantage at any stage of their transition (e.g. cross-sex hormones, gender-confirming surgery) and, therefore, competitive sport policies that place restrictions on transgender people need to be considered and potentially revised.
In this paper, we examine the scientific, legal, and ethical foundations for inclusion of transgender women athletes in competitive sport, drawing on IOC principles and relevant Court of Arbitration for Sport decisions. We argue that the inclusion of trans athletes in competition commensurate with their legal gender is the most consistent position with these principles of fair and equitable sport. Biological restrictions, such as endogenous testosterone limits, are not consistent with IOC and CAS principles. We explore the implications for recognizing that endogenous testosterone values are a 'natural physical trait' and that excluding legally recognized women for high endogenous testosterone values constitutes discrimination on the basis of a natural physical trait. We suggest that the justificatory burden for such prima facie discrimination is unlikely to be met. Thus, in place of a limit on endogenous testosterone for women (whether cisgender, transgender, or intersex), we argue that 'legally recognized gender' is most fully in line with IOC and CAS principles.
I'm really tired of repeating myself. People keep telling me that the topic of including trans and/or intersex women in women's sport is “complicated.” But it's not. It's very simple. Are trans women really women, full stop, or not? If you think “Yes,” then there's no debate: trans and intersex women, as women, belong in women's sport. If you think “No,” then there's absolutely nothing I can say that will change your mind. You didn't arrive at that belief through reasoning, and you won't get out of it that way either. It's a little like arguing with a flat-Earther: if you are convinced that the Earth is flat, then you'll find any reason, no matter how irrational, to hold on to that belief in the face of overwhelming evidence.
But this is what I find myself repeating over and over: to those who already think that trans and intersex women...
Currently, there is no direct or consistent research suggesting transgender female individuals (or male individuals) have an athletic advantage at any stage of their transition (e.g. cross-sex hormones, gender-confirming surgery) and, therefore, competitive sport policies that place restrictions on transgender people need to be considered and potentially revised.
This is side-stepping my point completely.
I said:
It isn’t an unfair statement to say that the physical performance of cisgender men is higher than that of cisgender women. This is why we have separate competitions for men and women.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_records_in_athletics
It is a fact that there are gender differences in the outcomes in competitions.
To what extent that these change when a person transitions is unknown and should be studied. It is simply dogma to believe that the moment a person has a prescription for HRT they no longer have an advantage.
Even among cisgender athletes there are genetic conditions and medications that disqualify them from competition. It is simply dogma to believe that the medication and treatments that transgender people receive have no effect on performance (and also, somehow, have the immediate effect of removing the advantage that cis men have over cis women).
It’s very simple. Are trans women really women, full stop, or not? If you think “Yes,” then there’s no debate: trans and intersex women, as women, belong in women’s sport. If you think “No,” then there’s absolutely nothing I can say that will change your mind.
Yes, this a wonderful example of dogmatic reasoning "If you believe this, then you have to believe this or else you're a heretic unreasonable and akin to a flat-earther. It isn't reasoning based on objective facts, nor does their conclusion logically follow.
As an example, I believe that cis men are men and also that cis men who use PEDs should not compete. It would be just as silly for someone arguing on the side of PED use to say that 'You either believe that men should be able to compete in sports, or you don't and there is no reasoning with you'. It's nonsense, it isn't reasoning it's intellectual bullying.
I absolutely support trans rights, that doesn't mean that I will allow another person to simply dictate my opinions. If a person unable to have a conversation and simply tries to dictate the things that I must believe then that person is wrong regardless of what other beliefs that they have which I agree.
fucking cunt.
Why don't they just have female, male and mixed sports?
The majority of sports leagues currently dominated by male players have no rules against women participating. They just typically cannot physically compete against the top .1% of male athletes.
So technically they are already the "mixed" sport league.
Because in almost all sports having a women on your team wouldn't be seen as an unfair advantage. Men are biologically different than women. Take high school cross country for example. Compare the times for the male cross country runners vs female. There is a big statistical difference.
Yea he's going no where in his presidential run
Neither are Democrats then cause like him or hate him, a majority of Americans agree on this. There are other ways to frame it & address the issues, like advocating for sports that are trans-inclusive, but to demand trans women play on women teams doesn't help you in elections.
I have always hated Gavin, but even a broken clock is right twice a day I suppose.
Garbage comment. Transgender women have the right to participate in the sports that match their gender.
Women have a right to their own fair competition.
The entire reason we made women's only leagues was so they had somewhere to compete against other women fairly.
Almost none of the major sports leagues have any rules specifically preventing women from participating. They simply cannot compete again men directly on a physical level at the top most level of competition.
The Williams sisters are arguably two of the greatest female tennis players that have ever lived on earth and they were both beaten handily by the 203rd ranked male player at the time. https://www.tennisnow.com/Blogs/NET-POSTS/November-2017-(1)/The-Man-Who-Beat-Venus-and-Serena-Back-to-Back.aspx
Women's sports need to only be for biological women in order for them to be fair.