7d ago

One party deserves criticism for being insufficient. One party deserves nothing but scorn and opposition.

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And yet when the legislature arrives to give us free Healthcare the Democrats don't pass it despite having a majority.
Both sides aren't the same, but their choices produce the same results.
- And yet when the legislature arrives to give us free Healthcare the Democrats don’t pass it despite having a majority.
  Obamacare saved my life and was the product of immense effort at a time when the Dems were more conservative than they are today. Blue Dogs were wiped out in 2010 and 2012 because of that (correct) rage against them.
  You can say what the Dems managed to do was not enough - and it's not. Millions of people are not as lucky as me (though I suppose poverty is a strange kind of luck - poverty in a blue state, perhaps, more appropriately) and still suffer immensely under our utterly fucked healthcare system. But it's not the same result as doing nothing - or worse, handing control over to the GOP. Millions like me owe a greatly improved quality of life, or our very lives, to the reforms passed.
  If you have a plan to destroy the Dems and replace them all with left-wing progressives, and put demo charges on the base of our utterly fucked rat's nest of a government structure, I'm not here to tell you not to. But I am here to tell you that both sides are not the same for millions of disadvantaged demographics, even if the Dems are not enough for those selfsame demographics.
  
  That's really the one big thing I can think of that they did get through.
  It got like 80mil people health insurance which was great.
  It was still a huge compromise from the free universal healthcare that was the original goal.
  It's worth noting that Obama did this by going around party leadership. Once he was in power he did not obey the DNC like other candidates have.
  
  It’s worth noting that Obama did this by going around party leadership. Once he was in power he did not obey the DNC like other candidates have.
  I mean, the president is party leadership. And Biden, an ardent party loyalist, is the only Dem president in the past 50 years which has been in lockstep with the wider party.
  
  When i say "the party" i mean the privately ran organization who is legally allowed to choose whoever their canidate is, and doesn't have to legally hold a fair primary election or any election at all.
  Sure the president gets a temporary seat at the table, but the other DNC leaders do not want them to be in control.
  The fact that Obama tried to push free healthcare made the DNC leadership furious, because that isn't what he told them before the primaries. But because they were stuck with him they instead had other loyalist dems try to help Republicans block his policies and then enjoyed the popularity Obama was bringing to the party.
  
  Sure there was a silver lining of sorts, but the ACA transferred more power and wealth to medical insurance companies than there was before, hastening our approach to where we are now. I'm sorry if I don't give much credit to the medicine we were given to dull the pain, because it didnt fix the problem. In fact, since so many think it did help so much, we have ignored the problem so we could argue about whether the medicine is nice or bad or rude or evil or etc.
  
  Wow a government that taxes you into oblivion for the War Pigs Somehow squeezes out a success. Every once in a while a blind squirrel finds a nut. You don't have a mental process that thinks in terms of like a program. It could be argued that the United States is not even a democracy, given all of the methods that the rich make it so that our candidates that have our best interest are never able to be chosen. And it's a mixture of people not understanding or knowing history with a sprinkling of illiteracy. that we continue to march down the road, choosing the same two parties over and over again, and living in a vacuum. Stuck in time. Repeating the same mistakes. The Yankees in whole both Democrat and Republican are some variation of fascist and relative to the rest of the world the left and right paradigm is more varied. America is a imperialist empire that employs fascist as useful idiots to do the bidding of the business owners and the capitalist class. Democrats just give you the impression that you have a choice. It's a form of pacification. They themselves can see themselves as powerful and still have faith in the institution. And they themselves can also be alright people, but the ROLE or FUNCTION that they play in all this is just controlled opposition. The more you go down the rabbit hole of world history and American history, you start to see patterns, and really nothing has changed. Like fascism and racism and all these isms are just character traits of societies. But they are symptoms of exponential processes inside of containers that can no longer withstand the flux. That's how you can have Nazi Jews. Not all Jews are Nazis, but Israelis in general, as a collective, are fascistic in nature. And there shouldn't be really a debate about this, but a lot of people are ignorant about what it's like in Israel and how the laws are written. To be honest it's almost like me. I live in Yankee land. I'm not a fascist. I think I am a minority in my opinions, but there is still a significant amount of people that believe as I do. I mean I can relate to a israeli., who chooses not to be a fascist. It's such a fucking mess. And at the root of it all, is that people just don't take interest really in current affairs, in a serious, responsible manner. As a collective, we are very misinformed Population. The Yankee likes to make fun of North Korea, but I think of us like North Korea. Like a mixture of Disneyland and North Korea. You put those two together and I think that's what it's like to live in America. But if you never left the country, you don't realize the rest of the people around the world live better lives. And like, I wouldn't stay here if I had a choice now that I know more about the world. Like vote Democrat. No thank you. Buy the plain ticket, leave the country forever and never look back. That's where I'm at.
  
  I'm not going to read that until you learn how to use paragraphs 🤷‍♂️
- There's always conveniently a cohort of Dems that vote against party lines. Every. Time. Then they can shrug and say "welp, we tried".
  Two sides of the same capitalist shit sandwich.
  
  This is because of red state Democrats like Manchin. Because every state gets two senators, there are more senators from red states than blue states. So Democrats have to capture more of the center to hey the majority in the Senate.
- Not the same results exactly, more that the dems enable the republicans by not pushing back, but both are far below the standard we should accept.
- Both sides aren't the same, but their choices produce the same results.
  The last few weeks are clear evidence of the opposite.
  
  Kids were still in cages during Biden. Prison slave population still highest history. Biden started the genocide and handed it over to trump. Biden deported more people than trump. Biden didn't feel like codifing roe. No min wage discussions whatsoever. No universal healthcare. Harris wanted a stronger border than trump and bragged about it. Half of the US can't even afford a 1 bedroom apartment under Biden and Trump alike.
  The two parties exist to appease their corporate donors. Nothing they do is in your interests.
  By the way, progressive measures passed in many states, even states that Trump won. People want progressive policy but neither party is willing to deliver. This is a feature, not a bug, of capitalism.
  
  Oh no, I angered the tankies.
  Both parties suck. The world would not be experiencing economic bipolarism, and we would not be spreading memes about American born citizens rotting in prisons in El Salvador just to cope had Trump lost the election. The two parties are not the same.
  
  It really is a thought-terminating cliché. You guys were talking about the actual subject before each other.
  
  Ohhhhh, the "T" word. Ez block for this uninformed and ignorant troll.
  
  "That person has different opinions from me, such an obvious troll!"
  Fair though, I would troll the shit out of tankies at every opportunity I have the energy for. Fucking .ml.
  
  Kids weren't being forced back to labour in factories by the CEO of Amazon -see Florida.
  State Prison populations logarithmically dwarf federal prison populations, overwhelmingly Red States With Mississippi, Lousiana, Oklahoma, Idaho, Arizona, Texas, Georgia as the magnificent 7. All notoriously with a racial bias. No democrat president would have made the move or received the support necessary to dismantle private prisons at this point in history. What Trump is doing is not legal, you cannot rule by executive order, the judiciary are just all bought or neutered right now.
  Biden's white house was about economic recovery because that was what was most important after Trump racked up the deficit. America enjoyed the lowest impact of inflation with the most economic regrowth of any country in the world after COVID. Things are significantly worse elsewhere. Inflation was going down under Biden, but social media gaslit the nation into believing it was way worse and once again that Trickle down economics would fix it.
  Crashing and burning the global economy was Big Tech's goal, under Biden the judiciary ordered Alphabet to break up Google's monopoly. It was just too late to happen at that point. No other government gave enough of a shit about our personal privacy and freedom to attempt to break the single largest corporate spy network in the history of existence. The democrats didn't do everything we wanted them to, that doesn't mean they didn't make some very important and historically significant moves.
  There was no presidential immunity until the very end of Biden's presidency at which point he was in noticeable mental decline and there was no supreme court stacked in his favour.
  It's not black and white, is all I'm saying. The constant self-criticism is what splits the Democratic party, reduces the turnout and allowed corporatism the opening to advantage themselves. We're lucky Trump still has the energy to rule without having the mental faculties to let others call all the shots. Sometimes, better than literal fascists is enough.
  
  I respect you for doing it, but the .ml at the end of their name really just means you're wasting your effort.
  None the less, good on you for fighting the good fight. I'm sick and tired of people pushing powerlessness and apathy under the guise of good will.
  
  I don't care to convince them. Every opportunity we have to counter the false narratives meant to divide the working class, is an opportunity for you, myself and everyone else provide our comrades who have not yet woken up to the programming the ability to:
  Recognise agents, bad actors and bots.
  Give them the tools to counter them and drive home the message of unity. We need to stop playing party politics and realise the struggle has always been up vs down, left vs right is just how the owners of our media push us against eachother.
  Thank you for contributing to the wider conversation.
  
  Pushing powerlessness? What are you doing to stop this? I'm with DSA and fighting IRL to stop this. Have you organized any protests? Have you phone banked anybody? Have you distributed literature? Have you actually gone out and talked with real human beings about what struggles they are feeling?
  
  Not American, and yes to most of that.
  The "both sides" argument is a dishonest one aimed at making people feel powerless. It can fuck right off.
  
  Have you run for local office? That's the only thing you can do that will actually change anything.
  
  lol no direct action is a thing
  
  Yes. A useless thing.

248 comments