2y ago

"Oh please stop blocking the roads UwU"

106 comments

First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: “I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action”; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a “more convenient season.” Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.
Martin Luther King Jr, Letter from the Birmingham Jail
Edit: I guess the more radical aspects of MLK's beliefs still upset moderates
- very much the vibes in these comments, "how dare you inconvenience us"

Honestly, what is this road glueing good for? You are annoying people who are not the root cause and allowing news sites and trolls to make an enemy of you.
Congratulations, you really showed them.
- It'd be much more interesting and impactful to do something like espionage on oil wells or pipelines. Hurt the profits of the companies forcing it rather than everything stuck in a bad system.
  
  They would just raise the prices of the oil they had to make up for it... for about twice as long as necessary. So they'll make more money, and we'll likely end up with a giant mess.
  
  Off you go, go do it then. Maybe don't leave it to someone else.
- I'm sorry, but how are daily commuters not a huge part of the cause? I recognize they're part of a larger system, and may have limited means to fix anything, but they're still participating in behavior that is destroying the only home we have.
  There are two alternatives: activists either do nothing consequential, people like you ignore them and nothing changes, or...
  There is a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart, that you can't take part; you can't even passively take part, and you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus, and you've got to make it stop.
  Mario Savio
  You're literally defending the moderate in the meme.
  
  I just don't see the point. What is "consequential" about shutting down a road? What are you trying to achieve exactly? Are you doing it just because it's beneficial in and of itself? Shutting one road out of the millions on Earth for like an hour does practically nothing and you should spend your time more wisely. Are you trying to win hearts and minds? People will do far more than just ignore your cause, they will actively despise it. Or is it just out of spite for commuters? Even though many of them, as you said, have limited means to change anything. Not everyone can afford to just quit their job to get one closer.
  
  Have these protests done anything? For example that due to the lack of public transport people are obliged to use a car, or many workplaces especially office work are put around cities not inside because of tax reasons? In my case I had to use a car for my previous work, for it was 45 minutes instead of 4,5 hours with trains and buses.
  These people do nothing, but scream STOP USING OIL, STUPID! and call it a day.
  Nobody is oblivious to this problem, but many have few choices.
  
  I’m sorry, but how are daily commuters not a huge part of the cause?
  But daily commuters aren't really the problem in itself, it's the combustion engine cars. Blocking road also blocks people in EVs or even the ones taking the bus.
- You must be a car driving loser. Getting mad sitting in your car stuck in traffic. All of that impotent rage. You are pathetic

Gluing yourself to roads (and damaging pieces of art) is the pinnacle of useless or even counterproductive activism.
You annoy everybody including those who agree with you. With a message that is new to nobody.
You bring no new argument or information to the table that could possibly convince those who don't agree with you.
You are literally sitting around doing nothing.
This is not activism, this is passivism.
It also does not help, when you fly to the maldives on vacation right afterwards or do other similar schizo things.
- People in my social circle defending stuff like this will say "it was worth it for the attention it got" and that's that. No further inquiry needed.
  
  At that point you have to ask "Who didn't know about Climate Change, and what did they learn by being made late for work?"
  
  Which is insane, people will turn against the cause instead of joining it.
- What do you want them to do instead?
  Just Stop Oil aren't coming with a message, they're coming with a demand. A very simple one that the science and international bodies are clear on.
  They've had hundreds of media appearances, are regularly referenced by politicians and have hundreds of people getting involved (and often arrested).
  In the short time they've been going they've achieved more than any orgs like Greenpeace etc.
  "This is not activism, this is passivism" What a joke. Putting your body on the line, getting a criminal record is passivism? Do tell us what activism you're doing if that isn't.
  "when you fly to the maldives on vacation right afterwards" Been hooked in by the right wing media good and proper.
  No artwork was harmed.
  
  redox reactions involve large amounts of energy being converted. These reactions can be made to happen at a very high rate. Two options for this would be to increase contact area between reductant and oxidizer, usually environmental oxygen, by grinding the reductant into a fine powder or you increase the temperature, as a rule of thumb, an increase in 10K (=10°C) is said to increase the reaction time by a factor of two. A good way to increase temperature is to confine gases inside a solid container, like a metal pipe, since a gas' temperature is inversely proportional to its volume.
- it's not about convincing anyone anymore. we're well beyond that point. those who are not convinced can get fucked now. we need drastic action and it's not happening. disrupting the function of society to demand change is effective.
  
  No it's not. At least not at that small of a scale.
- No, it is activism. It actively draws more attention to these causes, because attention drawing things like gluing yourself to a road attract the media to report on it. Sadly, if everyone just passively protests, it is not enough anymore.
  Also, gluing yourself to the road that keeps the machines contributing to global warming from running on it is kind of the point.
  Being nice doesn't work anymore. The world is actively burning. If anything, activists should be even more pissed than this, and angry at their leaders/elders for denying global warming.
  
  "We need to raise awareness about this thing everyone is already incredibly aware of!"
  How?
  "Hm... How about something that's low enough stakes people can continue to ignore us, but also in a way that will make people hate us!"
- Oh you find it annoying. Well, let me tell you a surefire way to step them from blocking the streets: just take proper steps to prevent co2 imission. Or you can cry about it on lemmy I suppose.

That is not what gatekeeping is. Gatekeeping would be saying they aren't real climate activists or something like that.
- Look at this dude here gatekeeping gatekeeping. /s

Liberals have a massive problem with connecting with the general public. They seem to pick all the worst ways to try to further their cause. They picks methods to protest that end up turning off people who would otherwise side with their cause.
You pick rush hour traffic when people are exhausted and simply trying to get home to block entire highways to protest environmental causes?? Really? You thought that would endear your cause to these people who are now stuck there? All you are doing is building anger and resentment. A few months back, there was some guy who needed to meet with his parole officer within a certain amount of time. He was stuck in this intentionally created traffic jam. If he was late for his meeting for any reason, he would be thrown back in prison. He was pleading with the protestors to let him go and they wouldn't budge.
Similar deal with groups like PETA. They always have this in-your-face attitude that gets under people's skin. I think most people would consider themselves animal lovers, so how does an organization supposed aimed at the ethical treatment of animals screw up their messaging so badly? That organization always finds the worst ways to spread their message. There was that story months back on how they essentially stole some homeless guy's dog. The poor guy had no other possessions and clearly cared for his companion, and yet they took the dog away from him because he wasn't able to give it the home that they felt it deserved. What an absolute douchebag move and if I recall correctly the authorities sided with the guy and he got his dog back. But why would you do that? You cause more harm than good.
Causing more harm than good is a common theme amongst many of these left-leaning organizations. It is very frustrating to watch since to a large degree I, as well as many others, would tend to agree with the general theme of what the organization is trying to do. Just don't do it that way.
- isn't it pretty well known fact that the group throwing paint and blocking traffic is being funded by Oil?
  seems like Astroturfing more than real protest.
  
  No. That's not well known at all because it's not the case.
  
  Fake news. Trumper thumper.

Reminder that ~~until~~ while profit is the only metric companies are judged on, they will continue destroying our planet.
- until profit is the only metric companies are judged on, they will continue destroying our planet.
  I think you meant while
  
  yup, thanks! I think I was going for until profit is no longer [...], but turned to while profit is [...] in the middle of writing.

Holy fuck the comments. Is it this community or people who came from elsewhere? Jesus what a shit show
- yes, in my country's subreddit this also happens a lot. a lot of carbrains, and maybe paid astroturfers too.
  
  Because yeah, people are either with me or just paid actors.

I protest by kicking dogs end starting forest fires. Thanks for supporting me unconditionally as long as we have the same goals.
- Be a retard elsewhere
- Republican 🚨

Your image 404ed

I disagree with many kinds of protests. For example, blowing up federal buildings.
Blocking highways is a bit further down the list, but still on there.

You can spread awareness without assaulting others, which tend to be the route for many activists.
Agression generates defensive reactions. If you question a person, patiently, pick at their knowledge or lack of it, you can create a change.
Approaching someone and calling them monsters because don't do this or do that is not a good conversation starter.
- If you question a person, patiently, pick at their knowledge or lack of it, you can create a change.
  In which universe, exactly? Certainly not in the one I inhabit. At least not at any real scale.
  
  If you're in the US, I'll agree, wholeheartdly.
- Agression generates defensive reactions. If you question a person, patiently, pick at their knowledge or lack of it, you can create a change.
  Literally ALL of history disagrees with you.
  
  Are you proposing we implement change via war? No. Enough of that for the last, lets say, 10.000 years. How about we start getting our collective heads out of our asses and force change the right way?
  The politians are crooked? Vote them out. No good option? Lets form another partie. Create lobby groups. Well organized, backed by science and data, not neo anarchist/hippie groups that think playing drums is a form of protest. Propose alternatives, force good and true information onto the public. Denounce mal practice, corruption and other bad actors behaviours, file actions against them.
  What good violent protest turned out? People arrested by the hundreds, assaulted by police, killed.
  It hurts a lot more a company or companies to have good unions and general strikes than violent protests in the streets.
- What do you mean? I primarily see people taking direct action, and then people complain and say "I agree that this is a problem, but don't protest in this way".
  I bet you have the same problems with blocking roads as you do with welding oil pipeline flow control valves shut or storming a coal plant.
  
  No problem whatsoever with that.
  My problem is that usually only foments violence - against the protesters - and distrust against the cause.
- saying "many activists" are "assaulting" others is a great example of the behaviour described in this meme, yes
- Protest is not about awareness making, though. You're apparently confusing it with advertising.

106 comments