Skip Navigation
networking @sh.itjust.works
sugar_in_your_tea @sh.itjust.works
• 50%

Review request: home network setup

I'm going to be overhauling my network over the next few months as I get ready for my new municipal fiber installation. I have a general idea of how to set things up, but I'm not an expert and would appreciate a few extra pairs of eyes in case I'm missing something obvious.

Hardware available:

  • Microtik Routerboard - 5 ports
  • Ubiquiti AP - AC-Lite; plan to add U6+ or U6 Lite once I get faster service
  • some dumb switches

Devices (by logical category; VLANs?):

  • main - computers and phones (Wi-Fi for now, I plan to run cable)
  • media - TVs, gaming consoles, etc
  • DMZ - wired security cameras, Wi-Fi printer (2.4GHz wireless g only)
  • guest - guests, kids computers

Goals:

  • main - outgoing traffic goes through a VPN
  • media - outgoing traffic limited to certain trusted sites; probably no VPN
  • untrusted - cannot access internet, can be accessed from main
  • guest - can only access internet, potentially through a separate VPN from main

Special devices:

  • NAS (Linux box) - can access main, media, and DMZ
  • printer - accessible from main, rest of devices on untrusted don't need to be (I can tunnel through the NAS if needed); can potentially configure a CUPS server on the NAS to route print jobs if needed

Plan:

Router ports:

  1. Internet
  2. WiFi APs
  3. main VLAN
  4. untrusted (VLAN)
  5. unused (or maybe media VLAN)

WiFi SSIDs (currently have a 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz SSIDs):

  1. main VLAN
  2. guest VLAN
  3. untrusted - hidden SSID (mostly for printer) - 2.4GHz only

If the VPN causes issues, I would like the ability to move individual MACs to another VLAN (say, to media, or a separate, usually unused backup VLAN). Not required, just a backup plan in case the VPN causes issues.

This is my first time configuring VLANs, so I'm not really sure what my options are. Also, I'm not super familiar with Mikrotik routers (I'm not a sysadmin or anything, just a hobbyist), I just got fed up with crappy consumer hardware and wanted something a bit more reliable.

Does that sound like a reasonable plan? Is there something I could improve or suggestions you have?

Edit: DMZ is the wrong term, so I replaced it with "untrusted". By that I meant a local-only network, so no Internet access. Ideally I could access these devices from my main network, but they can't initiate connections outside their VLAN. However, that's not necessary, since I can tunnel through my NAS if needed.

16
16 comments

  • A sizable UPS should be a part of this plan.

    4

  • I'm getting a little hung up on the terminology used. DMZ generally refers to the stuff that can be reached by the internet, but cannot reach anything internal. Think stand alone web servers / the router / etc. That's your "guest"

    The LAN is the internal only stuff.

    Without knowing your use case, I don't know why all of your "main" traffic needs a VPN any why you would separate media from it. Running your own DNS or using Cloudflare's 1.1.1.1 is maybe going to get you a little extra privacy if that is the biggest concern?

    4

    • My bad, I'm obviously not a sysadmin. :)

      I want my IoT devices to not access the Internet whatsoever, because there's no reason to. I'll be running a self-hosted home automation system (i.e. Home Assistant) that will communicate with them as needed. That's running on my NAS (old Linux PC), hence the need to bridge it with my main network. I can tunnel through my NAS to access devices directly if needed.

      As for my "media" network, I don't trust modern smart TVs and would prefer to treat them like the IoT devices, but I'd like to allow them to access certain services (e.g. Netflix and Disney+). I'd prefer a "dumb" TV and a separate streaming device instead, but that's not really a thing anymore. So the next best is to limit what it can access. I don't trust them on the main network, but unlike the IoT devices, they need some limited access to the Internet.

      why all of your "main" traffic needs a VPN

      Mostly privacy. My wife likes to play MP games on her PC, and I don't want those services to know our IP. I also don't trust websites generally, so I'd like to hide our IP for most, if not all, traffic. Our current ISP has us behind a NAT (we were assigned a 10.x.x.x static address), but our next ISP may have our IP public facing, and I still don't want our exact city to be discoverable (we're in a relatively small city, so easier to doxx). An added bonus is hiding our traffic from our ISP, but I don't have a reason to distrust our current or future ISP just yet.

      So I want to set up a VPN at the router level to a server nearby (for minimal added lag). I've tested it, and I think my router should be able to handle it just fine, and the pings to the nearby VPN are really low (<5ms).

      And I do use CloudFlare's DNS already, and my browser uses DNS over HTTPS. I'm just looking for a bit more privacy, without sacrificing too much lag.

      1

      • Mostly privacy. My wife likes to play MP games on her PC, and I don't want those services to know our IP. I also don't trust websites generally, so I'd like to hide our IP for most, if not all, traffic. Our current ISP has us behind a NAT (we were assigned a 10.x.x.x static address), but our next ISP may have our IP public facing, and I still don't want our exact city to be discoverable (we're in a relatively small city, so easier to doxx).

        You do you, I certainly won’t judge your choices or opinions or whatever. I will say that adding a VPN into the mix will add (probably significant amounts of) latency to any connection routed through it. This has the potential to make multiplayer games borderline unplayable depending on the type and its sensitivity to latency in general.

        If you’re that worried about being doxxed stand up a site-to-site vpn between your tik and an AWS VPC. Use the right region and you probably won’t have much latency issues, although the transit fees from AWS might bite you.

        On the flip side, since the mikrotik can act as a vpn server you could always set up your whole home vpn along with the vpn server, travel overseas to somewhere like Japan, set your upstream vpn’s exit as the same country you’re visiting, VPN in to your house over your phones Japanese cellular carrier data connection, then watch local JP netflix with the knowledge that the traffic is tunneling around the globe to get to you and marvel at the interconnectedness of the modern world. ask me how i know how amazing this is.

        1

      • On the topic of privacy, someone knowing your IP address in itself isn't really a major leak of information. Even if you lived in a village of 1200 people, that in itself isn't going to matter all that much.

        You've already given out plenty of information on Lemmy from a cursory glance at your profile, including that you are a certain distance from your job. I could probably look up smaller cities in your state near employers that match your description and pull up most of the possibilities. All an IP would do is confirm it, the data on "sugar_in_your_tea" is already out there.

        The best way to have privacy is to corrupt that data. You edit your comments to still live in (state) but now commute (distance to capital/larger city) and work for (insert larger employer details that are similar-ish). Instead of specific tech details you "work on web apps". Your spouse is just a spouse, you don't disclose details beyond that.

        1

  • Just my opinion - This seems crazy overcomplicated to me... Just to stop a Chromecast from dialing home and to mask your IP address? What do you think game servers are doing with your IP address anyway?

    You're going to be spending so much time troubleshooting and explaining to others in your house why "sometimes Netflix doesn't work" or why latency in games is sometimes high.

    Rather than handling all these issues at the network layer why not sate your paranoia with tor-browser and a desktop vpn when you want to mask your Internet traffic?

    2

    • What do you think game servers are doing with your IP address anyway?

      Nothing important, and sometimes leaking them:

      It's not the games themselves I'm worried about, but what gets leaked in a breach.

      I also don't want to give ad companies more ways to uniquely identify me, troll admins ways to doxx me, etc. They don't need my IP for anything, so if I can protect myself and my family with a simple config change, why not?

      Though maybe I'll make an "insecure" VLAN to allow temporarily bypassing the VPN if it causes issues.

      tor-browser and a desktop vpn when you want to mask your Internet traffic?

      I want to protect my wife and kids as well, not just myself, and getting them to manage their own VPN would be a hassle for everyone.

      My state is also passing stupid laws, such as parental permission for kids to access social media. This means they and I would need to provide them PII just to make a stupid account. My kids don't use SM yet and lemmy is my only SM, but I would like to protest this by using a VPN so my data leaves the state. If this passes at the national level, I'll have to VPN into Canada or something instead.

      1

      • Nothing important, and sometimes leaking them

        Sorry it's difficult for me to care too much about an IP addresses being "leaked" since they're basically public information. I can "leak" IPs by scanning a subnet and reporting systems that respond to "ping". Account information being leaked is much more serious though.

        There used to be a time when everybody's name, phone number and address were printed in books and literally dropped on your doorstep for free. But your IP address is now highly confidential info for... reasons.

        They don’t need my IP for anything, so if I can protect myself and my family with a simple config change, why not?

        Why not? Rapidly diminishing returns - that's why. Each component you add to your network is a point of failure that takes work to maintain and gains you very little in actual value. Your IP address is the very least important bit of information compared to account and credit card information you may be providing your services. Especially if you're on a NAT'd connection from your ISP - your IP address isn't even unique to you.

        And to protect you from... What exactly? Everyone who rants about "MY IP ADDRESS!" seems to fear only nebulous boogy men. Seriously I think VPN marketing is having a crazy effect on people. "HAXORS MIGHT GET YOUR IP ADDRESS!!!" ... and do ... what exactly?

        The biggest threat to self-hosting is automated scanning and intrusion done by hoards of bots. They just blindly scan and look for hosts exposing compromised services. They don't get "lists of IP addresses" from a leak to scan. Do you know how much greater effort it would be for somebody to spend time specifically curating IP address vs. just blindly scanning?

        1

  • I think the sketched setup is mostly good, segregating untrusted stuff is a great idea. I wouldn't hide any SSID's because that makes MITM easier.

    I'd invest in a simple Ubiquiti PoE switch and use your Mikrotik router as a firewall if it supports it. Put it between the modem and the switch and now you can use your switch to control access to the internet through VLANs. Use your ISP's modem as an uplink, have it setup in bridge mode if possible to prevent double NAT. A Ubiquiti switch integrates well with the AP setup and you can much more easily push out VLANs that work through the wired network as well. It also saves you the injector for the existing AP and makes it easy to add additional ones.

    2
You've viewed 16 comments.