1y ago

Discord to start showing ads in the coming week after resisting for almost a decade

www.neowin.net Discord to start showing ads in the coming week after resisting for almost a decade

In an apparent effort to boost revenues, gaming social media startup Discord plans to implement ads into its free service. The step is expected in the coming days after 9 years of ad-free experience.

I don't think people on this sub use it, but it's great news for us. The worse it gets the likelier people move on.

221 comments

Looks like Discord will do a Reddit in the near future.
I recommend switching to Matrix.
- the problem isn't switching, the problem is making all the other people using It to switch too, not everyone cares about security or ads
  
  Yep most of the communities I like are on Discord nothing I can't do.
  
  I have happily succeeded. While there are some communities that are still on Discord, the vast majority of my friends are accessible on Matrix.
- I hate this recommendation because Matrix is just a terrible user experience. It has basically nothing of value over Discord other than being open source. Which is important but it's not enough to counteract the amount of basic quality of life stuff that is just absolutely trash garbage on Matrix. Stuff that no normal user is going to put up with.
  If Discord does end up completely eviscerating itself the replacement will just be some new upstart closed Source program that is shiny just like how Discord took over from Slack it will not be the rise of Open Source because open source developers have no concept of user experience.
  I mean we don't even need to start talking about how bad all the client options are and how half the features don't work and all that. You can look no further than the login system. Average users do not like want or accept having multiple options for logging in. There's a reason that irc, teamspeak, mumble despite in many ways being objectively Superior especially in the case of the voice chats ended up relegated to only nerds like us. Because no one else is willing to deal with keeping track of servers to connect with or how to cross join or add users.
  Same reason that Lemmy is like 90% technical users that are already invested in something like Linux. The average user got frustrated by how fragmented everything is how many duplicate channels and content you would find between instances and how difficult it was to search instances in the first place. I am here because I can ultimately work around those emoians, but the average person? Is not willing to and they shouldn't have to
  
  I'd love to be able to disagree in any of your points, but I can't.
  The vast majority of users want something that simply works, is polished and intuitively usable. Reading docs, remembering anything other than the bare minimum, running into issues that don't get magically resolved within 5 minutes will turn them away forever.
  Even people with a technical background will at least partially compromise and migrate towards the services with the most users to not isolate themselfs.
  Matrix is neat, Lemmy is neat, Nextcloud is neat (well, in theory), Immich is neat, so many other privacy friendly solutions are neat. But they'll always be irrelevant in the global context.
  
  I am a big fan of Matrix and glad to see it getting some attention in this post. But it is definitely a bit rougher around the edges and esoteric compared to Discord. For more technically-inclined people, it's fine. But it's a bit much for some people.
  I'm no fan of Apple (and don't want to divert discussion here), but part of their winning formula is ease of use.
  
  Someone else mentioned Revolt.chat higher in the thread and it seems to be a promising FOSS replacement for Discord. It's looking to fix some of Matrix's issues like not having voice channels (voice calls on Matrix aren't the same)
  
  I hate this recommendation because Matrix is just a terrible user experience.
  Heck agree. In my experience, IRC is a much better alternative.
  
  some new upstart closed Source program that is shiny just like how Discord took over from Slack
  Guilded already exists. It's a Discord clone with more features, but no one uses it. I assume they are just waiting for Discord to fail one day.
  
  There is one huge thing of value in Matrix: e2ee.
  Sadly, the normies don't care about stuff like that, and the UX is indeed atrocious.
  
  Which is important but it’s not enough to counteract the amount of basic quality of life stuff that is just absolutely trash garbage on Matrix
  The thread is about discord adding ads in their platform, so much of user experience... there's no such trash on matrix
  You don't need to be a technical user to use matrix you simply don't have to be closed minded
- With how much they been cash grabbing, I'm not surprised.
  If only I could convince 30 people I barely know to switch platforms.
  
  The Discord server I spend the most time on is constantly looking for alternatives in case something better pops up or we need a backup.
- I’m constantly looking for something that could replace discord for me, I need something like the discord screen/game streaming to consider changing apps.
  
  I need something like the discord screen/gama streaming to consider changing apps.
  I second this. It’s one of our most used features. Whether it’s streaming for team mates or for spectators there’s almost always 1 to 2 people streaming/watching.
- Same. Matrix works like a charm.
  
  Don't get me wrong, I love matrix, but works like a charm is not how I would describe that. Element Just seems to make everything harder because you have to keep track of your session keys. That way if you have a new device and can't use the previous device you don't get locked out And then to top it off you have the export and import of end to end encrypted room keys which even for somebody like myself who is technical enough to manage it has managed to screw it up almost every time. I find something like session or SimpleX easier because you're not having to manage keys like that. SimpleX has an actual database file export instead of key management and you need only remember the decryption key. Session of course uses session IDs with a neumonic seed phrase like crypto
  
  I will gladly leave this shithole called discord, as soon as matrix start to support screen sharing
  
  Why can't I click and drag rooms into the position I want them?
  Ended up switching to alphabetical and numbering the rooms.
- They already have
  Pre IPO allocations were available two years ago.
- Matrix is rough, but it can be the future. Revolt seemed more complete for the time being.

Looking at all those companies that moved their support to Discord.
- But I thought we cold have free support in realtime with security updates for free forever?
  
  It would’ve been very smart of them to have this ad change only affect business ownedchannels, and then open up a fee option for businesses to no longer have ads on their channel

People aren't going to move on. Some of you really live in a bubble when it comes to this stuff. Users complained about ads on Facebook, reddit, Twitter, YouTube and everything else and no matter how many times you guys declare those services dead the reality is that they are still the default for most. Even in the unlikely scenario that a large amount of users do permanently leave, they won't migrate to the privacy respecting service you want them to.
- Some are and some aren't. Like a lot of folks on here are here because reddit went to shit.
  
  A minority are, yes. reddit is still massive and continuing to grow while Lemmy participation has fallen off noticeably and continues to decline.
- Nothing ever changes and it is pointless to try- got it
  
  What am I realistically supposed to do when the only place I can contact a lot of my friends is on discord, and sms is terrible.
- Welcome to lemmy
  
  Joined 2 months ago

(Last I checked) From this spreadsheet, Discord is the fourth worst messaging platform in terms of privacy. Now a new row for "Has ads" will have to be added...
- According to my iPhones privacy viewer it’s almost worse than Facebook.

Discord can do shit like this because they know many won't ever try to use an alternative. You need more than just "open source" "privacy" or "FOSS" to convince people.
- To be fair, there was a time before Discord. People once used MSN, Skype, Teamspeak, IRC, etc.
  They shouldn't get too comfortable with the idea that people won't just up and leave.
  
  There has to be something to leave for
  
  Discord has real advantages over many of those, and communities are slow to pick up and move. It'll take either a very bad decision from discord or a good competitor. I want that competitor to be Matrix, but it's far from perfect.
- This. Open source apps are generally awful at presenting themselves to a broader audience.
  Even for me, who's technical enough, an app being FOSS is not enough to even bother checking out. Yes, I've said it. Sorry, tinfoils, but I do put features above else. And, want it or not, general public does the same: if the featureset is not clear enough at first glance, and an app doesn't explicitly provide clarity on what it does and how it is better than competition, most people aren't even checking it out.
  
  It's an unpopular opinion but I completely agree. I've tried Matrix, not only could I not get more than 2% of my community to try it, but it's horribly unintuitive and limited for server owners. Shut it down after a few months.
  I have a rocket chat server going now, some similar issues, but at least it has more control than Matrix. Still only a fraction of my Discord and Telegram user base has joined, but it's similar enough that people are at least willing to try.
  FOSS alone is not enough, the wider public doesn't care, they just want something easy and convenient.
  
  if the featureset is not clear enough at first glance
  My experience as someone who has barely dabbled in Matrix, tried comparing clients, and knows a lot of people who stick to Discord: a lot of Discord users heavily use custom emotes, voice chat, and screen sharing. It's not even easy to figure out which Matrix clients support each of those features without installing everything and trying it out. There's a clients comparison on matrix.org that mentions Voip but not stickers or video.
  For stickers alone:
  Element is widely considered the go-to Matrix client but uses a strange integration system for predefined sticker packs instead of the MSC2545 stickers that more closely resemble what users coming from Discord would want.
  Cinny seems to have the best support for stickers/emotes but its site doesn't mention them at all. It supports uploading and managing sticker packs at either a channel or user level, provides a nice picker UI to send any picture from those packs as either a large "sticker" or a small inline "emoji", and allows using them for reactions.
  FluffyChat mentions stickers on its site and has the second best sticker support, with all of those except reactions and a graphical sticker picker for inline emoji (need to type them as shortcode).
  SchildiChat, Nheko, and NeoChat have some sort of limited support for custom stickers/emoji. NeoChat is the only one of those that advertises stickers on its main site. Nheko mentions them in a GitHub readme.
  Being able to freely use custom emotes without paying for a Discord Nitro subscription nor server boosts would be a great selling point but it's not something most users would be able to figure out before signing up. The limited client support isn't great; e.g. Fluffy is the only Android client that supports sending custom stickers but some people may dislike the chat bubbles style UI.
  
  We need to fix people. This proprietary shit is dystopian.
  Make the apps pretty, sure, but long term; fix people.
- Steam supports direct voice chat. My friends use it for gaming.
  Also, teamspeak.
  
  Steam doesn't let me make my own survers with categorized groups and stuff
- More, you need to convince the that this shit being inevitable is why you need FOSS.
  
  Ads are not enough reason to stop using it for the majority. You need to offer more than just ad-free. You need to offer the same or better adoption, features, and overall user experience. Discord has these all nailed.

Ads are the least of your worries on Discord

mumble is free and open source.
- So is Matrix and it includes self-hosting and end-to-end encryption enabled by default.
  
  Did they rewrite that crappy Python server in something with better performance by now? I tried self-hosting Matrix a few years ago and gave up after the one room I joined hadn't finished syncing after a whole day (admittedly it was their main matrix chat room with lots of members but still).
- Isn't Mumble just a voice chat software? I don't think that is the main use case for Discord for most people.
  
  Yeah, discord is for running a community not just chatting in voice.
  
  Idk, me and all my friends use discord for vc, plus screenshots and memes while we chat. You can do that in mumble. Not sure about broadcasting or anything (I started a server yesterday after the news broke), maybe there are extensions. Discord is just a means to an end for us.
- And no one uses it. The last time I used mumble was over a decade ago and its use was short lived.

revolt.chat is pretty good. It's open source as well. The interface is exactly the same as Discord. And best of all, you don't need nitro to have a gif background or profile picture. Markdown is also supported in the profile description so you can have very fancy descs.
- I didn't get past the sign in page because I was having too much fun looking at all of the localization options for their website.
  The default is "🇺🇸 English (Simplified)", but they have "☠️Pirate", "Toki Pona", "🥹Bottom", "😸OwO", "🪄 Enchantment Table", and many other funny options.
- Last I checked it didn't have voice chat and just ran in a imbedded webpage
  
  That's the current app. A native app is coming soon
  
  the Voice Server Backend is basically done, currently there's ongoing re-works of the desktop client (limited demo at https://revolt.chat/app IIRC), as well as closed betas for iOS and Android native apps.
  There's also a slew of Third-Party Clients and an open Client-Server API.
  Just remember that this project is built by people in their free time, not a VC-Backed company.
- revolt
  Are there public servers / communities?
  
  Yes. As I said, it's basically Discord.
- I'll keep an eye on this. I use discord exclusively for gaming purposes, and voice chat is pretty important for that bc I'm still on console mostly for the next year or so (building a pc finally, thanks to a new job). So if they can get that going, I could convince several people to switch once I'm also on PC. Till then discord for my PS5 is about the best I can hope for.

Good. Maybe people will finally move on to something else.

Enshittyfication as normal

Resisting? It was a clear strategy: use VC money to give away something for free then charge/monetize to give back those investors all the money, with interests

And thus begins the enshittification of Discord
- It has always sucked. From the beginning it was privacy-invasive, had no real business model, has had crappy Electron apps and has been proprietary.
- More like half way down the road

Is this april fools or for real
- The news broke yesterday sooooo
  
  Oh no.

Time to move to Matrix then, and I'm not even joking. Ads are Aids.
- Why not Mumble and IRC or XMPP?
  
  Which of them support e2e in group chats by default?
- Yeah god forbid anyone pay for the shit they use, just keep hopping around to suck the life out of every 'free' service there is. Nitro is right there.
  
  If it wasn't a privacy nightmare maybe I will consider paying, but data theft + ads? Naaaah.
  
  Nitro is right there... and yet... these changes happened.

If you don't use Discord for voice much, Matrix has a pretty solid bridges you can use.
Hosting your own Matrix server is suprisingly way easier than I though - got a VM on hertzner for like 5$ a month, and there is an Ansible script that takes care of the setup for you. It's also one of those rare cases where someone made an Ansible script that actually works, instead of you getting stuck in dependency-hell (seriously, fuck npm. Not a single docker or ansible tool that has used it ever worked for me out of the box. Python can get simillarly annoying).
They have a pretty easy to follow guide, and the whole setup took me like 20 minutes. I only edited a few options in config.yml (mostly to add Messenger and Discord bridge), and ran the ansible, and it worked at first try.
So I could at least ditch both messenger and discord apps from my PC and phone, without having to convince anyone to quit their poison - with only issue being that you can't use Discord voice. And that the messenger bridge is still unreliable sometimes, but those are still minor inconviniences in comparison to my deep-seated hate for Meta.
Of course - Meta still gets my chat data and content, same as Discord. But at least they don't get anything else from my phone or PC.
- Matrix bridges are nice until you realize that you have to be a mod in the server to add the bridge, you need to do it not only for every Discord server you want to use on matrix, but every channel as well. It's a huge chore. And ofc it doesn't work with Discord DMs.
  Not blaming Matrix or the matrix bridge developers here because it's not their fault. But let's be honest: matrix bridges are a pain to set up for Discord and for a majority of people aren't worth the hassle. Moving to Matrix would be the better choice if at all possible
  
  you need to do it not only for every Discord server you want to use on matrix, but every channel as well. It’s a huge chore. And ofc it doesn’t work with Discord DMs.
  This wasn't my experience at all - all I had to do was message the Matrix bot with servers I want to join (I'm not a mod on any of them), and it bridged all channels in that server. Also, Discord DMs are working fine.
  I'm using the mautrix bridge, which doesn't use a bot or anything like that, but uses your Discord session instead.
  
  you can do a puppet bridge for your discord account so it bridges all the guilds your in to matrix without needing discord guild admins to add the bridge to it

Goddamn I wish it wasn't so hard to convince friends that discord sucks. I'd rather just send SMS than use discord to communicate with my social circle.
- SMS? You mean the paid, vendor lock-in, MITMable traffic? Possibly one of the only options that is actually worse than Discord
  
  I don't always force my friends to use Discord alternatives, but when I do I force them to use Signal.

I wouldn’t say it’s great for me, because I have to use it for some people who just refuse to use an open source alternative.
- The people who refuse to use an open source alternative, I no longer speak with. I have made plenty of new friends on the open source alternatives that use the open source alternatives.
  
  this is wild. people who use open source software are a small small minority, and its good to have a diverse group of friends, not a tiny insulated group of the internet. dropping a friend over their choice of messaging app is pathetic

I only use it to play games with 4 other people regularly and another 2-3 people sporadically. When it becomes a pain to use, well move on just like we did with AOL Messenger, Yahoo Messenger, Team Speak, and however many others we've used in the past. Something else will come along. It works great for now, but we aren't loyal to it. We're loyal to playing online with each other. I would honestly pay $5 a month for a decent program, should no free one be available, but I'm already cutting out multiple streaming services, satellite radio, and all sorts of other shit because commercials are too annoying.

I wish I had enough time and knowledge to combine mumble and revolt.. That would be the perfect discord replacement.
Actually, I just want 1) gaming voice chat with 2) a shared music bot which 3) my non-tech friends would want to use

Is there any alternative with screen share feature and music bots?

April Fools?

Will using the browser version with the usual array of ad-blocks help?

....Maybe I should try to make an account on one of those competitors... what's it called? Revolt or something?
- https://matrix.org/try-matrix/ With the Element client, it's a pretty close experience to Slack/Discord.
  
  Not at all unless they have introduced voice channels instead of the antique group calls
  
  cinny.in is much closer to discord then element
- Yup, its not widely used mainly because of the chaotic development, lack of a devcent mobile client and an actual selling point since it is basically a 1:1 recreation of discord
  
  I feel like I have like three decent mobile clients, including the default?
- revolt is great, but development is quite slow and its just copy of discord
  
  A copy of discord without the fuckshit is all I want really.

I think the only way to get an open-source Discord is to recreate discord (their backend).
https://spacebar.chat/
granted it's a slow process but it can pay off if done right. I contribute what little I can to the project, as my Typescript is not the best and Discord knowledge even less.
- There are many, even revolt.chat is similar.
  But easiest to transition for me has been matrix

Discord has a monopoly on the organized group chat platform, there isn't a competent competitor, or at least none I'm aware of
- Matrix.org (Try Element)
  Revolt.chat
  I must say that Matrix is so competent that it can compete against whatsapp and Discord at the same time
  
  I don't know why so many people in the fediverse consider Element a competitor to Discord. I regularly use Element, but the non-text functionality just isn't ready to point people at as an alternative. They will have a bad time and write off Element potentially forever if they are shown that app as an alternative right now.
  Some examples of functionality that is important to discord but is not a good experience or is not ready in element yet: voice/video channels, screen sharing, custom emotes and reactions, channel organization and browsing (their latest attempt just doesn't do it for me).
  Additionally, there are times when encryption just has a hiccup still or someone sets it up wrong and things can be messy because of it.
  I really like element and they've done a good job so far, but It's just not ready for people to be pushed there from discord.

I truly don't have a problem with ads being in a free service. My anger will be based on how annoying they are when they roll out.
- The ads will become increasingly annoying snd intrusive over time based on every other website and app that has gone from free to supported by ads.
  Even if they aren't too bad at first, they will get worse. Just like the nitro ads that are already in discord.
- The problem is that no o.e will just serve a static PNG banner ad anymore. Ads these days inherently come with all the BS that makes blocking them mandatory
- people do pay for discord though. that was the entire justification for Nitro and Server Boosts. they made $440 million in revenue in 2022. they aren't publicly traded so there's no way to compare that with expenses, but i'd be pretty surprised if they weren't turning a significant profit.

We need FOSSCORD!

The website will ask for a user streaming to do something in-game or play a specific game while others are watching to probably earn something either in-game or in Discord.
I feel this is fine, the "streamer" can decide to do this tasks or not. And can disable receiving the tasks at all in settings.
- "please drink verification can"
- Yeah I don't think it is actually going to be particularly intrusive visually. It is based on data on games you play and stuff so one could argue that is intrusive. It's 6 months from now as they start getting more bold and greedy. The ads will get worse, they always do.
- Yeah I mostly agree, I don't like them adding ads but the way they're doing it seems not too intrusive so I'm not the most bothered

I'm on the verge of quitting after dealing with fucking groomers and nazis in ever server. I've already pulled out of every server and have remained DM-only. As I lose my last few friends my incentives to stay are going to be severely tested by having to deal with advertisements.

APRIL FOOLS!!???
No....?
Oh, okay..

The new update is great, it crashes the client anytime I mouse over the loot box announcement or try to watch a video my friend posted.

It will be interesting to see if PC ad blockers are able to mitigate them or whether they're going to tunnel them in like FB/Instagram do.

Gotta switch to revolt. My username: super_user_do#0384

I don't use discord but I don't think it's a bad idea. Those servers costs money
- They already can support them:
  Discord generated $445 million revenue in 2022, an 42% increase year-on-year
  They are getting greedy it has nothing to do with server cost
  
  Revenue alone doesn't mean much, how much was profit?
- They already have a premium subscription model

This is just Netflix all over again. If you don't want to pay for Nitro, watch ads. If you don't like ads, find the door. I don't get why people normalize freeloading online services and get pissy when they have to pay for what they use. Servers cost money. Pitch in with ads, data, or a subscription.
Otherwise go do your open-source self hosted and P2P programs, they all have the same problem. Reliability.
- I've already paid with my data.
  Want me to pay for a service (something I'm happy to do)? No ads and no selling of my data.
  
  What data? Who bought it? Do you have a single fact to back that up?

221 comments