Not all humans inherently deserve rights just because they are human. Think of people like Hiter, Jeffrey Dahmer, and the dozens of other evil people. No one would reasonably think they deserve sympathy, because of what they chose to do.
If your evil enough to commit such a heinous act as child rape, I don't see any legitimate reason why that person should deserve any sort of sympathy.
Subconsciously everyone agrees on this to some extent. Look at prisons, (depending on the crime) they remove your right to vote, own a gun, even walk outside, and have certain jobs.
The reason I believed my take is controversial is because of how I think those pedos would lose their rights. I believe people as evil as them aren't people at all. They are simply containers of flesh with a human face, and should be seen as such. I have no issue with the idea they should be used as slaves and test subjects. Arguably this would actually benefit humanity (especially in terms of medicine) because now instead of risking the lives of innocent people like doctors or everyday Joe's, we could use them to see if the experimental drug has any side effects. Honestly, what are they going to do? Revoke consent? I wonder of the child they raped got that same privilege...
I'm sure this goes without saying but the person would have to be caught red-handed with undeniable proof to be subjected to this
Creating a class of people who don’t have rights, no matter what they’ve done to “deserve” it, just creates a class that unsavory people can use as a dumping ground for their enemies. Antifa is all pedophiles now. Pro-vaccine people? Also all pedophiles. Democrats? Believe it or not, pedophiles.
Even if you somehow had a work force to deal with this population that was made up entirely of angels (which, good luck), it is impossible to prevent innocent people from being subjected to it. There is no such thing as a legal system that has never falsely convicted someone, either from faulty evidence or malfeasance.
Queer people in particular have also been victims of false accusations of pedophilia, both historically and recently. You can’t just ignore that there is a rabidly bigoted segment of the US that would not rest until all queer people got classified as pedophiles.
Tl;dr: unsurprisingly your revenge fantasy has bad real world implications
Everything is a privilege, the only reason we have rights is because governments allow it, which means if tomorrow they decided rights don't exist, then they don't exist
It's your last sentence that perfectly points out the flaw in your logic. There will always be variations on your "perfect pedo" that you've created in your head that would warrant some consideration regarding punishments and rights.
Being a person that was molested as a child, I find you just choosing one type of predator absurd and dismissive of every other victim that doesn't fall into your "special victim" classification. I don't think the person that offended against me was any worse or better than someone that did it to an adult or committed elder abuse, etc.
There will always be variations on your "perfect pedo" that you've created in your head that would warrant some consideration regarding punishments and rights.
Well yes, this is all a hypothetical, I'm not a lawyer or going to write a whole 300 page bill on the ins and outs so yes there's some assumptions that need to be made
I find you just choosing one type of predator absurd and dismissive of every other victim that doesn't fall into your "special victim" classification.
I wasn't dismissing other victims all rape is evil and abhorrent, but rape against a child who's brain isn't developed and doesnt have a strong foundation of the world is especially cruel
I wasn’t dismissing other victims all rape is evil and abhorrent, but rape against a child who’s brain isn’t developed and doesnt have a strong foundation of the world is especially cruel
I disagree with you there. It's all equally cruel. In my case, my young age allowed me to recover from something that perhaps I wouldn't have as an adult. If it had to happen, I'm glad it happened at the age(8ish or so) that it did.
Ideally it should always be extremely difficult and expensive, and certainly not of economic benefit, to take basic rights away from people, otherwise that line you've staked out will move relentlessly to include more and more "inhuman" people. As we know, because we don't live in an ideal world.
But the other problem is what do you think your idea does to the scientists and slave owners and everyone else with knowledge of it? A disgusting idea doesn't get less disgusting just by applying it to only a few. This is just degrading to everyone involved, and erodes compassion on all sides.
It's certainly controversial. And pathological, maybe even psychopathological thinking. But it also seems to be a lot of American's and literal Nazi ideals.
But it also seems to be a lot of American's and literal Nazi ideals.
It's surprising how fast people jump to Nazis when they can't find anything else to argue. Did yk the Nazis breathed air, that must make breathing evil. The nazis had jobs and worked in government, that must mean jobs are evil.
Nazis aren't evil because of what they did, but who and why they did it to. Hitler targeted innocent people because he was a racist. Child rapists are not innocent people.
I honestly can't wrap my brain around how idiotic and 1 dimensional these arguments are. Fr the only legitimate argument any of you have made is one guy said that the people in power would frame non rapists in order to enslave them. Other than that one guy, everything that everyone has said has been along these same lines "well, your doing bad so that makes you bad" under that logic all prison systems, wars against legitimate terrorists, or any kind of punishment would be banned. Without repercussion people would be walking around doing whatever they wanted.
SMH. These arguments aren't the ones that are one dimensional. I'm not arguing anything because nothing but that your own arse could be targeted for punishment, rightly or wrongly, has given you pause. That's sick. It's dangerous to society. Please seek behavioral therapy. Your thinking screams that you find pleasure in making others suffer and are seeking to justify that when it's not justifiable. I understand you probably can't help thinking that way. You can seek a qualified therapist to evaluate whether you can or can't, and to keep those impulses under control, if you can't. Otherwise, to keep yourself from forced labor or torture or a gruesome death.
Not all humans inherently deserve rights just because they are human. Think of people like Hiter, Jeffrey Dahmer, and the dozens of other evil people. No one would reasonably think they deserve sympathy, because of what they chose to do.
Nice pivot. Your point is about rights, but in your argument you equate that with sympathy.
Even a person who doesn't deserve sympathy deserves, or rather has human rights – even when they're violated.
Nice pivot. Your point is about rights, but in your argument you equate that with sympathy.
When you boil it down, that's what rights are, government sympathy. The government feels sympathy to its citizens so it trys to protect them by giving them rights. Take North Korea for example, that dictator has no sympathy and in turn the people have no nights. If tomorrow the government said we don't have rights, then what are we going to do about it?
Even a person who doesn't deserve sympathy deserves, or rather has human rights
Using this logic the prison system is a violation of rights. If prisoners still deserve to have rights then why can't they vote, or own a gun? The prison system is a direct violation of a human's rights yet everyone agrees we need it to have a civil society
Taking away a prisoner's right to vote is wrong (not to mention dangerous for a democracy) and not everyone agrees with it.
Owning a gun isn't a human right.
And a government is an entity made up of rules and thousands of people who constantly change. It can't feel sympathy towards individuals.
Anyway, you're quick to claim that "everyone agrees" or "no one would reasonably believe" the points you are for or against, but you have an incredibly US-centric view, and not even half the US citizens would agree with you.
How do you feel this applies to non-acting pedophiles?
I think it's easier to make this kind of opinion about child abusers or rapists, but there are pedophiles who are aware of their problem and seek assistance in dealing with it in a way that avoids harming any children, e.g. therapeutic solutions. Does your judgement apply to them in the same way?
How could families & or Carers even know if someone was a "N.A.P" when and or if the potential threat is right there chatting to their 8 y.o in the front yard or park with a parked car nearby? Should they carry a neon sign atop their do, "Non convicted Pedo, means no harm!"
Silly thing to say unless....
You react violently like the people you despise (pedos or not). I do believe it’s a psychopathic behavior that your should be cured, and meanwhile, your rights should be revoked as long as you have those bursts of anger.
Pedophile is a state of existence, much like gay. It's a sexual attraction NOT an action. A pedophile doesn't choose to be sexually attracted to children, any more than a gay person chooses to be gay. (The obvious difference is that gay people that are adults can consent; there can be no moral, ethical, or legal relationship with a child.)
What you're looking for a child molester. Not all pedophiles are child molesters. Not all people that molest children at pedophiles; many are likely not, but are simply opportunistic sexual predators attacking the most vulnerable population.
Beyond that, 100+ years of psychology research has demonstrated that punishment is a very poor deterrent to behaviour. If you want to change the way people act, then you need to reform behaviour, rather than punishing it. But it's clear that you don't care about actually solving the problem, you just want revenge.
Rights are innate, a property of being born, not something granted, or conferred, by government or anyone else. Anything granted by someone else is a privilege, not a right.
Whether one's rights are constrained via due process is a different question: criminal's rights are curtailed when they're jailed after being convicted by a jury of their peers (a right established in US criminal law, to be tried by one's peers, not just some magistrate, or some land owner).
Rights are innate, a property of being born, not something granted, or conferred, by government or anyone else. Anything granted by someone else is a privilege, not a right
This would make everything a privilege. The only reason rights exist is because governments allow it, so if tomorrow they said we don't have rights, then what are we going to do about it?
Even the American Bill of Rights has been edited, added to, and have had things removed over time
The fact is rights are a human construct that only exist because of us. The universe or God doesn't give us rights, government leaders do.
Whether one's rights are constrained via due process is a different question
The concept of constrained or curtailed rights is a contradiction. If rights are inherent by birth and can not be taken away, then that also means you can not reduce, shorten, or edit them in any way. As that would be a violation of rights that seemingly can not be taken away
Rights aren't, and shouldn't be, all or nothing. Criminals, for instance, forfeit certain rights depending on the crime and the jurisdiction. Often they forfeit the right to freedom and end up in prison. In some places, for some crimes, they might even forfeit the right to life and get executed.
But the important things is we have a system for determining what those things are. If, as with your example, we said pedophiles have zero rights, that would mean that anyone would be free to kill them, to steal from them, to torture them, or whatever. That doesn't seem like a good move for society, especially given the potential for abuse.
If, as with your example, we said pedophiles have zero rights, that would mean that anyone would be free to kill them, to steal from them, to torture them, or whatever.
That's literal outlawry: being put outside the protection of the law. Anyone being free to kill an outlaw is a feature of outlawry, not a bug.
This doesn't justify anything, just because someone did it to you, doesnt mean you can do it to someone else. If anything this supports my point, because now there would be less child rapists which means less people would turn into predators
They can't help thinking that way if they were subject to it, part of the mind, maybe. Look how you're thinking. It's horrifically broken. So hi, choose to think differently or maybe do you deserve being used as a slave or a nice visit with Dr. Mengele?
I don't think that, I do think this attitude is extremely problematic and would encourage you to seek behavioral therapy, stat.