Fish Suffer Up to 22 Minutes of Intense Pain When Taken Out of Water
Each year, a trillion or so fish are pulled from the water, typically destined for our plates.
So fishing for sport where they catch and release is basically torture by getting injured by the hook and then asphyxiating for however long they are out of water before being released.
Yup. But deep down we all kinda knew that, right? It was always fish torture for sport.
I'm pretty sure a lot of people legitimately do not see fish as more than objects, and I mean they never fully made the connection not that they do it intentionally.
It never made sense to me that “fish don’t feel pain”. Like, even as a kid I didn’t understand why they wouldn’t. Who would be okay with a metal hook through their mouth? Even if they didn’t feel the same kind of pain we do (I’m sure they do), there’s got to be some part of their body screaming that things aren’t okay. Add on top of that the sudden inability to breathe and it really is just torture.
I like the idea of fishing (like relaxing on a boat with a goal) but I couldn’t do it
Not really deep down, but yes
The stats on fish survival after being caught and released is actually pretty sad. If I remember correctly there was a lengthy study that showed a survival rate of only like 40%.
Was this the fish passing after a few minutes, hours, days? If you remember at all. Was there any controlling for gill damage during the catch? I know some idiots who will hold them up by the gills for pictures, I wonder if that causes damage? Or just dying from shock? I wonder if I can find the study
Suddenly all the cutesy indie life sims with fishing minigames don’t seem so wholesome any more
Feeling like a fish out of water sounds much darker now.
Yes, I'd say so.
Catch and release is animal abuse and luckily prohibited here
Where is fishing banned?
If by "release" you mean "keep alive out of the water until they die in 22 minutes" then yeah, that's a barbaric way to release D:
Not in this article, or anywhere else is it currently known what a fish feels in relation to how humans feel pain. Including asphyxiation or hooks. We don't currently have the capabilities to know how a fish interprets that stuff.
Well, IMO that's actually pretty easy to determine. I assume the pain you feel being cut by a hook is simmiliar to pain I feel being cut because we react the same way. Basically every living thing reacts the same way to cuts, yelping, bleeding then flight/fight. Cats, dogs, animals of all sorts go through the same steps when they are cut so it's a safe assumption their pain is simmiliar. And things that don't react, such as cutting a techincally alive potato, aren't really feeling pain. Idk maybe potatoes silently scream, can't disprove it, but that's just not the same as creature that flee from threats
So while we don't know what a fish thinks about suffocating in air, it's a reasonable assumption that it's similar to humans suffocating in water, unpleasant. We both thrash around and do our best to breathe again. Sure, in a philosophical sense it's imposible to know what other creatures think, even other humans that can verbally communicate, but that ignores some of the more obvious context clues.
I remember there was a study done on how to best slaughter swine (pigs).
The methods that were investigated included: a mechanical hit on the head, suffocation in CO2, and some other measures.
What was found was not only that the suffocation method caused significant stress in the animals, but also that the meat collected this way tasted way worse than meat collected through other slaughtering methods.
this could be relevant in this case: if fish suffocate slowly to death, meat producers might have a financial incentive to change that, to be able to sell better-quality meat, possibly at a higher price. anyways, it would make for good advertisement. that is why meat-producers (fish-producers) should take this seriously.
And the reason we still use CO2 slaughter instead of something like Nitrogen is because.... They already have machines built for CO2 and just don't want to pay the cost of changing practices.
Pure greed and laziness.
They just know people will buy the meat no matter how much the animals were abused so why would they bother? Even those who see themselves as animal lovers happily look the other way with every purchase. The industry has all the incentives to be exceptionally cruel so of course it is.
My slaughterhouse uses radon. The meat makes my testicle feel funny, and we throw up a lot. And I haven't had hair in years. But it's cheap! And so tender.
I never understood the CO2 suffocation idea.. I mean, I don't k ow about fish, but mammals supposedly have a good detection for CO2 in their blood and it'll set off panic alarms everywhere.
Ignoring the vegetarian discussion for a minute, if they could at least use a different gas, say nitrogen or something, it should be a lot less stressful for the animals
I have a crazy idea here. Now hear me out, this is gonna sound like a wackadoodle idea, but,...... how about we don't murder the animals? Crazy, I know.
Stress is a hell of a drug
Without water, the delicate gill structures that exchange oxygen for carbon dioxide stick together, causing CO2 from respiration to accumulate. These rising levels trigger nociception – the body's alarm system – which causes the fish to gasp. Eventually the elevated CO2 levels acidify the animal's blood and cerebrospinal fluid, ultimately resulting in unconsciousness.
Holy shit. That's horrific.
The article does a shitty job of linking to the paper
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-025-04272-1
It makes a pretty good case that fish experience a lot of pain immediately after being taken out of the water.
I don't think this will do much to impact commercial fishing, it seems like it's targeted at the slaughter stages of fish farms
Our population voted someone into the highest office riding on the promise of drilling for more oil and increasing factory farming. We have atomized our culture so much that corporate forces have stripped people of their empathy and care and passion like an overripe banana and we don't mix perspectives anymore so that we can pull people back.
There's no hope of ending this misery until those of us who remain thinking with our minds get off the computer and start socializing, organizing, challenging people and pulling people into our idea of a better tomorrow. Most people don't even know where to find other people to talk to and debate with and this is by design. That's the trap we're in we need to break free of, and then maybe if we can get to that point we can start making cultured meats and alternative proteins a thing.
Otherwise, we're going to fish the oceans until they're dry and we will create hellish suffering for every life form involved until there's nothing left to feel pain.
Otherwise, we’re going to fish the oceans until they’re dry and we will create hellish suffering for every life form involved until there’s nothing left to feel pain.
take comfort friend. our atmosphere will be unbreathable and we'll cook in our own juices long, long, long before the oceans dry up. It's becoming, every day, ever more unlikely that we'll wake up to the obvious dilema and be able to save ourselves. And there are some who profit from continuing down the path of stupidity, and our society is following them.
so take comfort. your premise is 100% on target, but the timeline is probably a lot shorter.
Yeah if people don't care about the equivalence of caging for meats then fish enduring pain is useless.
so those fish that jump out of the water at times experience pain the moment they leave the water? what time range are we talking? the are fish literally crossing land to get to other waters.
This is why net fishing is so problematic (apart from obvious environmental conserns and bycatch).
Stun your fish people. Don’t let their blood clot and lungs collapse while still conscious for multiple minutes. It’s cruel.
Let their lungs collapse?...
Yes. The g folds in front and everything shortens.
That's why we call them gls.
You can also spike the brain of the fish. There's stuff online about Ikejime which is supposed to be a way to quickly kill the fish to improve the quality of the meat. There's resources online about it.
So what you're saying is that Kurt Cobain was wrong and it's actually not OK to eat fish because they do, in fact, have feelings?
Something in the way…
How about a new sport... Catch the fish under water and slap him a little, but not too hard?
Or how about just riding your rubber boat to where the fish are, then dropping a speaker and shouting "fuck you fish!" Threw the speaker? You could even hurt them intellectually!
it's a lot manlier and cooler to stand in the water and grab the fish with your bare hands anyways, then you can look it in the face and tell it to fear god before letting it go
You could even do a Hakka and watch the fish pee themselves! But a gentle slaps would also be satiafrying.
Where did they throw the speaker?
In to the water! LOL.
I believe this is why Japanese fishermen will sometimes use the ikijime method where you kill the fish fast. I believe it also improves the quality of the meat too.
And yet others will prepare Ikizukuri.
Ikizukuri (生き作り), also known as ikezukuri (活け造り), (roughly translated as "prepared alive"[1]) is the preparing of sashimi (raw fish) from live seafood. In this Japanese culinary technique, the most popular sea animal used is fish, but octopus, shrimp, and lobster may also be used.[2] The practice is controversial owing to concerns about the animal's suffering, as it is seemingly alive when served.
The restaurant may have one or several tanks of live sea animals for a customer to choose from. There are different styles in which a chef may serve the dish but the most common way is to serve it on a plate with the filleted meat assembled on top of the body.
Ikizukiri may be prepared with only three knife cuts by the chef.[1] They are usually presented with the head still whole so that customers are able to see the continuing gill movements.[3]
look at the video, it's FUCKED UP. they removed all the meat from the fish and kept it alive attempting to breath on the plate covered in food
Wow that's so fucked up
With net fishing, they're still out of the water quite a long time whilst being hauled up, dumped, and sorted before being thrown in their sorted holding tank.
that's why there is Ikejime, the japanese method to dispatch fish
I just use a fish bonker. A firm strike at the base of the head with a club is instant. I can't say if it preserves the meat as I normally eat it right away or store it for the winter months in the freezer.
I'm still not going to tell you where my secret fishing spot is, no matter how many times you ask or scientific studies you perform.
there's a trend on TikTok where you catfish (heh) men and ask them what their favorite fishing spot is
This is why you just shoot them in the head with a harpoon when you take them out of the water
Most fish are caught using trawling nets, which as far as I know, can be up to 50 miles long. Gonna need a fucking attack helicopter to handle all that.
I was under the impression that to a fish pain is more of a "get out of there" signal than what it is to us.
is what happens to us not in fact a "get out of here" signal to us? what makes you think a fishes subjective experience of pain is any more pleasant than your own?
Bring back dynamite fishing then!
Poor thing :(
I've heard that water-boarding is a very intense form of torture; and that is essentially about making a person feel like they are drowning. I wonder how the fish experience compares.
Nice fluff piece, but it's still complete speculation as to how fish "feel" when out of water or anything else. Currently, science can't tell if a fish can hurt in the same sense that humans can.
If they come up with something dirt cheap to kill them faster, I'm all for it. No down side to give a fish the benefit of the doubt. This isn't something I'm going to worry about, though.
Broadly scientific consensus is that at least bony fish likely experience pain in all of the same quantifiable ways that humans do. They exhibit avoidance learning, they have a central nervous system, nociceptors, opiod receptors, exhibit reduced avoidance responses to noxious stimuli when given analgesics.. Etc.
The few scientists that have argued over the years that fish likely do not or cannot experience pain have been in the minority in the last 50 years, and each passing year finds decreased evidence for their claims. Dismissing it all as 'complete speculation' is.. Very inaccurate.
Worth reading:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pain_in_fish
Also - there already is "something dirt cheap to kill them faster" - hardwood fish bat. Lasts forever and instantly stuns, and with a couple of strong well-aimed blows will definitely kill.
I'm sorry but that's idiotic
The hell you mean? Of course it senses hurt. Why do you think humans are special cause we say ow?
What the fuck.
Maybe they are kinky. Idk.
OK but how do we know their response to the phenomenon in this article is experienced by the fish in a way akin to pain and not akin to fear or anxiety? (Or all of the above). Its just weird for the article to say a fish is for sure feeling pain, and not provide actual evidence for that.
I'm not saying the experience isn't awful for it, so please dont turn the conversation that way.
I’ll be vegan once we figure out how to stop killing other humans.