Proton is transitioning towards a non-profit structure

Just sitting here waiting on the peeps who know more about stuff to chime in on this, cause it sounds awesome. But I've been burned before so I'm hesitant

Seems solid.
It doesn't change a ton, but the point was basically them putting their money where their mouth is and saying "now we can't sell out like everything else."
If you liked them before, this is great. It means google or whoever literally can't buy them out, it's not about the money. If you were iffy already because they're not FOSS or whatever other reason, this doesn't change that, either, for better or worse
- What is this buying out talked about something not escapable if not some legal reorganization is made? It has been being talked about other companies, too, and it sounds like if you have a form of a company, you can't legally refuse monetary offers from someone to buy your company.
  Is there such a legal mechanism that forces an owner to sell out if an offer is made, or is this more about proofing a company against CEO/shareholder personal sell out decision?
- Maybe the founders can't sell out anymore, but looking at what Raspberrypi just did the company can still end up partially on the stock market.
- Awesome! Been a customer for a while, waiting for the family pack supporting at least 4 separate users for a custom domain for a fair price.
Seems legit. Going towards a better business model. Don’t know if anything stops them going from non-profit to profit as OpenAI did buy at least their movinf the other way now with intent towards the opposite.
I’ll keep using their service at least.
- OpenAI
  I think OpenAI has always been a for-profit private company despite its name.
Seems like all that will change is the fact that all profits made will be reinvested in the company, im not an expert though, so i may be wrong
- Well that's cool:). Remove the profit motive/surplus goes a long way to slow down evil.
- Proton will still be a for-profit company that will be majority-controlled by a non-profit. The non-profit will not own all of the business either, so there will still be profits going to shareholders.
- Many for-profit companies do this as well.
Fair honestly, I'm more or less in the same boat 😅

In this world of enshittification and organizations becoming more and more aggressive, it's so nice and refreshing to see proton doing the opposite and moving to a better model :)

I think proton was never going to function as a profit-first business. Too many enshittified rival businesses. Kinda the natural outcome.

Proton and Mullvad leading the way

Except Mullvad VPN is better for privacy.
- Can you explain how or why is the Mullvad VPN better for privacy than Proton's?

This makes me want to upgrade my plan.

I’ve got the unlimited plan and it’s well worth the money. Simplelogin integration is great.
- I wish the forwarding with email aliases would function a bit differently. Right now the alias is set as the recipient in the email and I wish you could set the recipient email to whatever email you want (like one of the additional emails you can set in Proton Mail) because the way it is now it makes my general filters useless and I would have to add even more filters.
  Edit: I created a suggestions on their feedback site here: https://protonmail.uservoice.com/forums/953584-proton-pass/suggestions/48496442-show-use-forwards-to-email-as-recipient-in-forwa if anyone cares to vote for it.
- I don't use proton but I feel like when people email me from simple login alias emails, it breaks encryption.
I upgraded mine but haven't talked to the wife about including her yet because the family plan is for up to 6 so it'd be cheaper to just buy two individual subscriptions, she doesn't really care enough to justify that much extra cost. Hopefully Proton adds another plan or two for groups!

Support the apps that protect you. I recommend Signal and Proton VPN.

I recommend mullvad
- At my school, mullvad is one of the only VPNs that work since basically every port is blocked except ports 80 and 443 using TCP. Mullvad can use wireguard over TCP on 443, which is very useful.
- I hear Mullvad is great but my problem with it is it doesn't support port forwarding (ProtonVPN is pretty much the only one in the market AFAIK that does).
  Not so much a problem if you have high up speeds (like with fiber) or don't do a lot of torrenting (or are an asshole and torrent without seeding), but I don't have fiber and have a max up speed of like 15–20 Mb/s.

The opposite of the OpenAI.

Honestly, a very impressive move. Makes me way more confident in the trajectory of the company and I'm happy to have been a visionary user for multiple years.

I wonder, though, just how much of Proton A.G. does the foundation now own? They say it's the largest shareholder, but they didn't say "majority shareholder".

Man, I wish I could afford their rates. They're just a little bit higher than I can justify compared to other options for a given service.

It is a nice PR but for me I am not impressed. Rolex is also a non profit organization in Switzerland and and mostly help hiding there finance.

Correct me if I am wrong but all I see is words and promises. I would trust them if they release the yearly finance transparently.

For now the only act I can judge them on is their collaboration with police to give ecologist activists IP.

It is a nice PR but for me I am not impressed. Rolex is also a non profit organization in Switzerland and and mostly help hiding there finance.
Okay but Rolex is Rolex. There are uncountably many non-profits, and many (most?) do good work. I don't think Rolex is representative of your usual non profit.
Can you elaborate on that? They turned over an ecologist activists IP?
- You can search it online : I don't know any good media so here's the first result on DuckDuckGo https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/6/22659861/protonmail-swiss-court-order-french-climate-activist-arrest-identification
- "Crucially, the order did not provide the contents of the activist’s email, which are encrypted and cannot be accessed by Proton. Yen said a similar order would also not be able to provide ProtonVPN metadata, as VPNs are subject to different requirements under Swiss law."
  From the verge article
For now the only act I can judge them on is their collaboration with police to give ecologist activists IP.
You mean because they were forced to? Like every other Swiss organization under the exact same order? I always find this type of "argument" so purposefully obtuse.

Non-profit and all this stuff is nice, but where is the dark secret?

No dark secret, Proton products are OpenSource, made by cientifics of the CERN in Swiss. They make its incommings with the premium products, serving the free ones without ads and trackings or loggings.
- Makes me even more suspicious, I have to comprehend this.
For profit companies are horribly inefficient and there's better ways to organize human labour, despite capitalist propaganda.

I was this close to upgrade to the paid plan, and this is the final push I needed

@retiolus

Nice !
Maybe that will allow them to get rid of their marketing habits !

Would be very nice, that's one reason I use Tuta and not Proton

We recently purchased the family plan even if it is quite expensive for a couple. Reading this of course made me feel better about it.

I was sketched out by their move to get rid of inactive free accounts, but this is nice to see. Really hate the idea that if I'm unplugged just for a bit I lose a ton of contacts.

You need to be unplugged for 12 consecutive months for Proton to delete your account because of inactivity though, which seems fair for free tier accounts. A simple login is enough to prevent this, you do not need to send an email or whatever, simply log in once a year. You also get reminders sent to your recovery email before this happens. Data storage for inactive free tier accounts isn't free for Proton.

Not to rain on the parade, but as long as we allow the reality-sized hole that is non-profits owning for-profits, this isn’t something I can get terribly excited about.

Welp, that's one more reason not to use proton

You….want them to be able to sell out in the future?
- I want them to have the clear objective of making money. That gives they consumer some control as you can just not give them money. That still can be true for non profits but it isn't as powerful.
What? Why?
- Because non profits are not universally good. With a company the objective is clear.
  I don't terribly care for proton or any other "secure and private" email. I think it is mostly snake oil.
?
- ~
Are you a bot?