A much better national motto
A much better national motto
113 comments
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The "in God we trust" slogan thing was first used during the Civil War, and only brought about as an official thing in the 1950s when we had to differentiate ourselves from "those godless Commies".
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This seems like a good spot for a reminder that Thomas Jefferson edited his own copy of the bible to remove all of the magical/religious elements and left only the philosophical lessons.
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And then there was Thomas Payne, who was as close to an overt atheist as you could get in the 18th century without having someone come up behind you and slit your throat.
There's also a long list of great quotes here from the founders-
Have you considered that system of holy lies and pious frauds that has raged and triumphed for 1,500 years?
-- John Adams
And he was one of the more religious ones.
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There were many spicy quotes during the Enlightenment -- the founding fathers were reflecting a common sentiment among the educated classes in Europe. Anyone interested in that time period would enjoy Peter Gay's book about it. It's incredibly well-written and much less dry than a book about that subject has any right to be.
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One can be part of the system and recognize its faults.
Yeah, there were some people sort of bucking the system, and probably some closeted atheists, but criticizing the church for its corruption and failures is no different than us doing the same about our government today.
The next line after the quote is:
Upon this system depends The Royalty, Loyalty, and Allegiance of Europe. The Phyal of holy Oyl, with which the Kings of France and England are anointed, is one of the most Splendid and important Events in all the Legends.
So not necessarily an anti-deity statement, but more an acknowledgement that the Church is a system by which European rulers reinforce their power and wealth. The whole letter to Taylor from Adams really rants about the church’s power and attempts to control people’s lives.
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If the scriptures had been written with one half of the care and ability with which they have been explained and defended, they would not have been the cause of so much contention and mischief, and they would not have stood in need of so much explanation and defense.
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To suppose that God Almighty has confined his goodness to this world, to the exclusion of all others, is much similar to the idle fancies of some individuals in this world, that they, and those of their communion or faith, are the favorites of heaven exclusively; but these are narrow and bigoted conceptions, which are degrading to a rational nature, and utterly unworthy of God, of whom we should form the most exalted ideas.
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The discoveries of science have proved that the opinions concerning a firmament above, and a flat earth beneath, are completely inaccurate; but faith delights more in sublimity than truth; it soars far above science in its discoveries, and holds accuracy in contempt.
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In those parts of the world where learning and science has prevailed, miracles have ceased; but in such parts of it as are barbarous and ignorant, miracles are still in vogue; which is of itself a strong presumption that in the infancy of letters, learning and science, or in the world's non-age, those who confided in miracles, as a proof of the divine mission of the first promulgators of revelation, were imposed upon by fictitious appearances instead of miracles.
--Ethan Allen, Reason: The Only Oracle of Man
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Payne was a proto anarchist. His response to coming to America was “this no king thing is awesome but let’s look at the Haudenosaunee Confederacy and maybe since we’re on their land consider that they might be living better lives than us.
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who was as close to an overt atheist as you could get in the 18th century without having someone come up behind you and slit your throat.
I don't really think that was a risk. My understanding is it was more like: "well this is what smart people have believed for centuries- what idea do you have for where we came from?"
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Anyway to get a copy of this?
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~2MB PDF! There was more left than I expected!
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reminds me a yard sale plaque i saw once:
"like a good neighbor, stay over there"
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"Good fences make good neighbors"
~Robert Frost
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Ah yes, alternate timeline that they add "Mind your business" to the pledge of allegiance instead of fucking "under God".
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one nation, mind your business, indivisible...
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that shit always pissed me off so much
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The pledge of allegiance (to a literal flag no less) is really weird. But, the enweirdening was enhanced in the 1950s when the government added "under god" to make the difference from the commies more clear.
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And the national bird a turkey instead of an eagle.
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My coin would read: GO FORTH AND FUCK THYSELF
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Note that Mr. Franklin’s motto meant “Get your shit done” rather than today’s interpretation of “Get the fuck out of my face.”
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Sorta. It meant mind your business if you want to be successful as in like literally being there at your business to make things run smooth. That said he also heavily implies that you should stay out of others business if you want to succeed.
So it more or less means both just more nicely put like a southern "bless your heart" not actually being a positive.
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Republicans: Clearly Benjamin Franklin was woke, and probably a communist!
(Because this would work against their efforts at book bans, their anti-trans crusade, their general anti-lgbtq+ crusade, their crusade against reproductive autonomy for women, and probably other things that aren't immediately springing to mind.)
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I could be dead wrong, but I actually get the impression this wasn't really meant in the modern colloquial sense of keeping your nose out of other people's affairs, and more in the literal sense of keep on top of your business dealings. Which would make sense, since it was to be printed on money.
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That sort of admonition would quickly be used as a mild insult though, no matter how literal. Same with something like "set your house in order" which is a biblical phrase with a very similar meaning to what Franklin was going for, as it's related to there not being much time and Franklin relates his phrase to time flying. It's too direct for English.
I think both of them have a more specific meaning of something like a combination of "you're the master of your own fate" and "seize the day."
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That's a good point and I have no doubt you are correct. Interesting wikipedia entry, thanks!
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Benjamin Franklin distributed a book containing basic first aid, which included which herbs can be used to "restore the menses."
Thats an old timey way of saying inducing an abortion. So you're not that far off from what Republicans would say about him if they were actually educated.
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He was later anti-slavery so yes, many would consider him radical even by today's standards (think of how people feel about prison reform, ask people how they'd fix homelessness or mental health crises, and you'll see a shocking amount of people are 100% fine with slavery)
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A motto that many people today should familiarize themselves with.
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It means both "leave other people alone" and "focus on your business" since the US was founded by landowning businessmen.
So slightly better, but not quite as good as "Don't tread on me" would be (if it wasn't currently coopted by fascists).
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As a NW Ohioan, i like "Don't Give Up The Ship" since it carries a similar ideal without all the baggage of "Don't Tread On Me" or "An Appeal To Heaven".
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I agree, but I like to think it means the first one. Honestly, I don't know that "don't tread on me" works in that vein perfectly either, just because it's not as simple to understand. Maybe "mind your own business?"
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With the Teletubbies sun
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Someone sue the British for trademark infringement!
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what would he say about all the chuds today flying gadsden flags while trying to dictate how everyone lives their life, i wonder..
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I'm a lil related to that guy
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All good and all but even with something like this, what if your business was to try to rule the world and everyone in it with the billion dollar resources at your disposal?
The problem isn't the money, the religion, the systems .... it's the age old ancient idea we never seem to want to acknowledge or deal with, ever since we first stepped out of our cave thousands of years ago ... the idea that some people should rule and others should be ruled and that we should all fight and kill one another to maintain that order.
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the idea that some people should rule and others should be ruled
Well there are movements like voltunarism and individualism. Something Franklin probably would've been a supporter of.
113 comments
i still prefer the original official motto: E Pleribus Unum - From many, one - for it speaks to the true power of our people united in common cause and the very real danger of our division.
"E pluribus unum" = “Out of many, one."
How precise is this translation?
I've also heard "From many, one", which can be taken two ways: the same celebration of the individual (presumably over other individuals), or that the many come together as one, which is a much clearer call to action.
I prefer the Voltron version.
What is the distinction between "out of" and "from" in this context?
I myself prefer E Pleribus Anus
That's a great saying, but the flag is even better *
Many things come from my anus
Ani*
Which, makes it even better, IMHO.
Also has a secondary interpretation: out of the many countries in the world, one of them. Putting the US on equal footing with the nations of old — despite not having a king with a divine right to sovereignty.
I like this interpretation because anno 2024 it also counterweights US exceptionalism.
Not American, but here's my 0.02 euros:
The strength of the country was always in its' diversity and the fact that motivated people came together to build better lives.
Nowadays there are people who hate the former and in terms of the latter, immigration is pretty hard and the H-1B is a lottery that unfortunately favors sweatshops (and yes, I'm salty because I'm a software engineer with no formal education so y'all don't want me).
I get that there are legitimate reasons for limiting migration (your own people do want to work too, of course), but it does also limit economic growth and influx of different cultures.
Being from a small country in the EU that nobody's heard of, the EU and its' open borders are sorta doing the same to us now: Don't get me wrong, it's still primarily other white people migrating here, but at least they're people of slightly different cultures, with different experiences. It benefits everyone because we all have something to learn from one another.
Idk though, “mind your business” is the motto of a nation dedicated to freedom.
It's kinda vague though. It could also mean "Out of many, there can be only one." Thereby establishing a Highlander-like contest among nations to be the last one standing.