Do you like systemd?

omg scary systemd, with Artix I go

Systemd has been a complete, utter, unmitigated success.

I fully agree. I am a user with a bit of technical background, but not a lot of detailled knowledge about the inner workings of an operating system (i know boolean logic and basic programming structures - in Pascal lol - from the 90's, what a transistor does and stuff, how to build my own PCs and handle filesystems and troubleshooting).
With init scripts, i hit a wall pretty fast.
With Systemd i know how to start, stop and configure services, and the suite built around it uses the same conventions everywhere, making the everyday life with Linux for someone like me so much easier and more transparent than ever before.
Have you considered that just "reaping old process IDs" wasn't enough responsibility for an init daemon on a secure, robust system? That maybe it should be protecting other parts of the system and tracking the liveness of a desired service?
What is the benefit of specifically doing that in init?
If I see an argument like this then I can only assume the interlocutor doesn't do software engineering.
Its more likely that the user simply has simple needs like running stuff at startup which any init system can do and doesn't see as much benefits as poster.
Also who loves systemd-resolved?
- Being able to assign a nameserver per interface with a domain wildcard is a fucking godsend. I use it every day with a hook script because my job uses some private domains but I don't want to send my entire DNS history through the VPN. Now ~job.com goes to tun0 and that's the end of it.
  systemd-resolved is not perfect but with libnss's overly rigid nature the only alternative for my use-case would be to recreate similar functionality to resolved with dnsmasq – which is just objectively worse especially when you want to use DHCP sometimes but not always. Why reinvent the wheel? resolved does its job and does it well. I had some issues with it a few years ago but have been using it for the past couple years without complaint.
- What is the benefit of specifically doing that in init?
  What's the alternative?
  Also who loves systemd-resolved?
  I don't think I will ever love anything DNS-related, but it's still the best solution I've used for name resolution on a system with many interfaces.

The other day I wrote I like snaps and shot more rope than Spiderman.

Flatpak is amazing especially with storage being so cheap these days.
- OK, Satan.
- Just replying to keep the vibes going.
- I still remember the bad old days of stale repositories and compiling from scratch. Never again.
- I just had an issue with the vscodium flatpak, been using it for two months with no issue in an online course, got to learning GUIs, import module, doesn't exist. I couldn't figure out why it wasn't there, installed three different python versions of it three different ways, still nothing. Couldn't even get vscodium to point to a different interpreter that I knew was there (yet it doesn't say it's not there, just that some things won't work). Still nothing. Three hours later, after trying everything I could think of, I realized that it was because I installed the flatpak version when it clicked that it worked in Geany and I didn't have python 3.13 in my repos, yet that was the only one I could see in vscodium.

Systemd is fine.

Journald is fine.

But someone pass me a mace I can beat systemd-resolved and systemd-logind to death with

EDIT: Oh come on

You'll love resolved when you have to deal with split DNS ;)
- Oh trust me I have. resolvconf and openresolve are awful too but for different reasons

Rule 34:

If there's a user base, there's buttplug.io support...

Error: That number is already picked for a different rule. Please select a different number.
- Sigh
  sudo Rule 34:
  If there's a user base, there's buttplug.io support...
  --force
- Maybe consider rule 33. 'Lurk more its never enough'
Let's hope the user base is flared.
"I know my playerbase." -Hakita, the dev of Ultrakill

Systemd is the greatest innovation that Linux has ever seen bar none.

Since I started actually doing system administration and actually interacting directly with SystemD all of the hate for it I'd soaked up from enthusiast forums melted away. I've never used any of the other init systems so maybe I'm missing out, but I do appreciate SystemD for what it does
bwwwwt
- Happy cake day
pipewire feels close

Okay, so, this place IS filled with furries. Cool.

Linux wouldn't work without furries
Every online space is filled with furries, especially the most furry-hostile spaces!
- That's disgusting, I prefer furry-hostile tabs!
We're all shipping the penguin and the wildebeest.
:3
Is putting phone in ass a furry thing?
- The depicted character has a snout and cat ears
- Thought it was more a prison thing.

I don't get the systemd hate. The most common complaint I see is that it's too bloated, but Arch uses it, so what gives? Is it just that people dislike change? Like Wayland hate (not Wayland frustration)?

From what I heard, people hate systemd because Linus Torvald was approached by the NSA to create a backdoor on Linux, he said it wouldn't be possible to change the kernel because there were too many eyes on it, there was a mysterious hack of kernel.org introduced a mysterious code but it was spotted and removed... well, what was the only other thing common to all Linux? The sysv-init, but it was too small, too tight, too specific for them to create a backdoor there, they needed something big, bloated, doing way more than it should do, like it was just supposed to start the system but it can also do unrelated stuff like handling DNS, and an American company shows up bringing systemd, that solved all the problems the NSA had to create a backdoor on Linux, and all distros jumped into the honeypot :)
- Lol strangely believable in these times.
- Nice conspiracy theory.
- and all distros jumped into the honeypot
  As a filthy casual this is the most distressing part.
  I’ve observed the situation shift in just a few years from
  “~~Winter~~ Systemd is coming”
  To
  “~~Winter~~ Systemd is here, it’s everywhere, and i hate it”
- mind sharing some sources?
- Damn, really make sense. Especially nowadays a lot of distros now defaults to systemd.
- @grok, is this true?
Generally I see a few:
People wanting the highly deterministic, but slower behavior of the rc scripts.
People liking the fact that the rc startup was generally almost entirely defined in plain script files
Some folks criticizing certain opinionated things in systemd, as systemd delves deeper into things like capabilities and users.
Systemd can sometimes be a bit weird about how it does/does not capture stdout/stderr as one might guess in some situations.
Some folks not liking the journald angle of binary-only files
Mainly the last point is the only one I personally find potentially aggravating, but since I never really am in a broken system without journalctl I'm not too bothered by it. I have saved myself some effort thanks to systemd including stuff that the daemons used to provide for themselves.
- People wanting the highly deterministic, but slower behavior of the rc scripts.
  This is literally it for me. I got to work on an alpine system and it was like a breath of fresh air - I could edit the service script files directly. So easy, so little abstraction
I'm more frustrated with GNOME devs sabotaging Wayland.
- I'm more frustrated with GNOME devs...
  Say no more!
- That is a self-inflicted wound caused by how Wayland was designed, particularly the part where they offloaded so much responsibility onto the different compositors.
So people hate on systemd because they interpret it as an init system thats gone too far and has thus violated the unix principle. in reality systemd is an entire suite of tools based around a very feature rich and robust service management suite that also includes an init system. there is something to be said about the Linux ecosystem's reliance on systemd, but there are no comparable tools. this is why Arch uses systemd. if you dont want to use systemd, you can use distros like Arco Linux; however currently Gnome no longer works on Arco
- Part of the problem with it is that it is very difficult not to use it, for instance if your code uses dbus, that makes systemd a dependency and almost all of the tools are like this. Want to use alternate software with systemd init? A-OK! want to use systemd tools without systemd init? Too bad! This inter-dependence is what I think makes it break the unix philosophy, its components dont like to be replaced or used outside of the "intended" environment of systemd init, keeping it from being replaced without breakage on lot of systems.
  On my install for instance, systemd is roped in by xdg-user-dirs (and hence steam), flatpak, fcitx5, and cups. And that is just a few. So the init system isnt a problem to me, the lack of drop-in replacements for its suite of tools is.
- So you're saying systemd is the emacs of init?
@JackbyDev @nutbutter
People dislike unwanted change. Imagine, you are using some distro for years, and after some update everything changes and you cannot configure system usual way. Many software is changing behaviour You need read tons of docs to change something or worse, while your system hang at boot.
My first try using systemd ended in kernel hang after too much systemd's dmesg flooding (that was slow arm board, so it's unlikely someone might help me with debugging it)
But yes, many people just hate systemd because it was forced change, not even because it's too complex
- I'd argue that the systemd trend actually is the one that's change-adverse.
  I remember that before systemd there was a lot of innovation when it comes to init systems… the flexibility of the script-based inits made it so most distros had their own spin. And there was more diversity in components that now are part of systemd. I’d argue that ever since systemd became the de-facto standard, innovation in those areas has become niche. Distros are becoming more homogeneous and less open to changes in that sense. Some components are becoming more and more interdependent and it's becoming harder to ship, for example, Gnome, without systemd.

I still don't get what you guys have against Windows. Bill Gates has done so much good for the world.

(My body is ready.)

I don't mind all the ads, they're always for things I was just thinking I needed to buy anyway.
- Wow there, easy, you’re gonna end up on ER.
  At the very least take a smal phone.
Razzzzz
Bill Gates actually was pretty cool, it's windows after Bill Gates that's terrible. I can't say there was anything Bill Gates did that I didn't like, he was like the Gabe Newell of operating systems before steamdeck.
- Put your phone on vibrate, etc...

Systemd has simplified my life on a few occasions, and it seems to be reliable from what I can tell. At the end of the day if I can get the OS to do what I want in a relatively simple matter, that's all I care about.

In all seriousness, I've yet to encounter a situation where Systemd made any meaningful negative difference in my Linux experience.
I've never had problems with any init system, Systemd or otherwise.

Must your climax be fueled by our frustrations? Vibrators are cheap, you know.

Must your climax be fueled by our frustrations?
Maybe that's exactly what gets him off.
- Frankly, this should be implemented with something like a combination of:
  https://github.com/QazCetelic/lemmy-know
  Lemmy Know (let me know) is a lightweight CLI application / Docker service that monitors Lemmy for reports on posts and comments and sends notification. These can be sent to a Discord channel with a webhook or as MQTT messages (schema), which is useful for more complex setups with e.g., Node-RED.
  https://www.home-assistant.io/
  Open source home automation that puts local control and privacy first. Powered by a worldwide community of tinkerers and DIY enthusiasts.
  https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/mqtt/
  MQTT (aka MQ Telemetry Transport) is a machine-to-machine or “Internet of Things” connectivity protocol on top of TCP/IP. It allows extremely lightweight publish/subscribe messaging transport.
  https://github.com/DevelopmentalOctopus/ha-buttplug
  Buttplug.io Integration for Home Assistant
  https://intiface.com/central/
  Intiface® Central is an open-source, cross-platform application that acts as a hub for intimate haptics/sensor hardware access
  Some collection of hardware devices from:
  https://iostindex.com/?filter0Availability=Available%2CDIY&filter1Connection=Digital&filter2ButtplugSupport=4
  That'd permit for, say, having message events drive a state machine to control devices or something like that.
It’s just not the same

I don't know what systemd is but this is pretty much how I picture all linux users.

Please tell me your phone has a flared base?

My biggest complaint with systemd....

Service xxx stop/start/restart is so much easier than

Systemctl stop/start/restart xxx

It fucking annoys me

I neaver bothered me too much, can you not alias stop to sudo sytemctl stop xxx
Like that you can write “stop wpa_supplicant” instead od “Sudo systemctl stop wpa_supplicant. “
I mean, you could write a shell function or script to just wrap it if it bothered you that much?
- I'd rather complain
It seems like every Linux distro I've used both of those will work fine.

I dislike systemd less than I dislike sysvinit, so it has that going for it.

She wants the system's D. 😏

Listen, we've all done it.

We all have bash or fish or zsh aliases to do it in command.

We all love the feeling of a pulsing phone in our asses.

But we don't talk about it.

But we don’t talk about it.
- The first rule of FUDposting club.

I just like being able to use things I learn across Ubuntu, Debian, Arch and RHEL.

Also prefixing a command with systemd-cat and having the logs go to the journal is pretty nice. Then I don't have to worry about rotating them.

I don't know if I like how you're characterizing furries. Not all of us do this, and I don't do it... often.

Have one extra buzz from me as well. Screw RedHat and everything it does.

Well, now I do.

i use mint btw

This must be why my post saying Linux made me gay got so many up votes.

may i ask you to kindly provide the source of this image?

frenky_hw, here's the specific image: twitter (hopefully it is, twitter doesn't work for me rn)
- twitter doesn’t work for me rn)
  https://nitter.space/moschino_bunny/status/1457773412957376530
- tysm❤️

Username checks out

Used systemd for years; realistically my first init.

Switched to Gentoo.

Switched to OpenRC.

Lost logs at work on a server.

Some small inconveniences show up on systemd.

Yea, systemd is not that great.

There are people saying they don't want to care about an init system, but it's the same attitude as of those who don't care about what car they drive. Yes, it gets the job done, but that's not good enough for me.

I want the job done properly.

Good boy.

I love ubuntu snaps.

(sets phone on vibrate)

Systemd is great! The best thing about it is how efficient and minimal it is!

Well, that's one way to "use" systemd, I guess.

Please mark as nsfw

There's already systemd in the title
- @SkaveRat @possiblylinux127 systemd should be in CW (but do not know if lemmy supports CW)

OwO

I would replace grub in a heartbeat with systemd if it a feature like grub-btrfs (boot time snapshots for btrfs all in the GUI)

Zfs is better anyway
- How is it better? For desktop use specifically

I don't really mind it. I picked it when I installed CachyOS.

Bzzzzz

Yes I like it and it is loads better then what came before it.

And then the phone exploded.

SystemD is that like ntoskrnl.exe?

delete it for free space! (and freedom!)
...
...i'm not asking. do it.

All down votes are from all the systemd haters!

it's fine

they're fine

we're fine

it's fine

I've only ever used systemd, and I'm not really aware of what else is out there, since I think systemd has been the default on all the distros I've tried. Anyone have some good resources on other alternatives and how to start playing around with them?

Most non-systemd users are either contrarians or people who don't want to switch their workflow from some other system that they already know perfectly.
I will always welcome alternative systems on principle alone, but at this point there is not much need for linux "consumers" to consider anything else (unless their distro doesn't ship with systemd of course).
Have a look a this:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Init

For my basic needs it always felt more confusing then necessary. Don't have a hate boner for it, but i prefer not to use it at this point. I'm using Void and i really like how simple runit is.

When looking for an alternative to replace Arch ARM on my Raspberry Pi I tried Void but gave up after discovering it does not use systemd.
Ehh it's very easy to use. Simpler then init actually but some people hate change.
- Well i'm not saying it's rocket science, but compared to runit/rc.local or simple autostart scripts i do think it's easier. I converted everything from my autostart script to systemd services when i was still on NixOS, and the whole thing seemed so convoluted. With having to set services to depend on each other, and also had a lot of problems with things like nm-applet or blueman-applet not showing up in the bar at all, and couldn't find a way to fix it.

I'm still waiting for them to get DNS and user services working. Then it'll finally be usable.

DNS
There's systemd-resolved. I don't know if you mean that it has some kind of limitation.
- It doesn't work with private DNS servers or forward DNS over VPN. Removing it is always the first thing I have to do with new Linux installs.

I do not particularly care for it and most of my systems are still systemd free. Much like pulseaudio in its later days, I've learned to deal with it when I must. Also like pulseaudio, something better will probably come along.

This not a kill tony joke?

No, kill Tony just sticks his thumb up his butt for Joe Rogan. Nothing to do with Linux.

yesss

I don't mind the config.

I don't mind most of the features.

I dislike them trying to use timers to get rid of cron

I like it's logging for linux on the desktop if I lose some logs becuas of space that's what i'd do anyway

I don't like it's logging for servers, those logs are necessary and need to be preserved.

journalctl -f is pretty cool

journalctl -fu is pretty cool