VWOOM
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VWOOM
The problem is that with that line of thinking, just about nowhere on the planet has a right to exist.
No country or government has a "right" to exist. They're given that ability to exist by the people they're supposed to serve. If the system is not serving the people, it shouldn't exist.
Supreme executive power is derived from a mandate from the masses, not some farcical electoral ceremony.
If I declared myself chancellor because a bunch of my friends voted for me they'd put me a way.
Agreed. The United States is doing a piss-poor job serving the people, and while that may be due how the country was shaped during colonialism, it is not due to its ongoing colonialism. It's a totally different situation than Israel.
Now let's talk about fiat currency vs crypto currency
A world without borders sounds like a dream 😍
I was watching the falcon and winter soldier and I was thinking the flag smashers had a good point and were doing good for the world. They wanted no borders and no more nationalism. At one point they randomly had the flagsmashers kill some innocents to make them the antagonists
Until someone walks into your home
Big difference between nowhere and no state.
You're beginning to get the point of anarchism.
No I'm not. Anarchism keeps getting stupider and less likely to ever be a workable solution to anything the more I look into it. It's at best a nice thought experiment.
It's the state that has no right to exist, not the people or the place.
Now what is a state?
Look it up, but it's basically a formalized group of people who believe themselves entitled to power and claim they can use violence to get their way and you are not allowed to defend yourself against it.
The state is a cultural pandemic, this is the real mind virus, our species existed for like 200,000 years in complex societies without the state, 500 years with ubiquitous state (look up enclosure acts that forced everyone into a state) is all it's taken to destroy the entire planet.
By your definition of "state", states have existed for all of human history. The only thing that has changed over the years is that human population and areas of control have expanded to encompass the whole planet, instead of having huge areas that are outside of anyone's control.
Now you're getting it
They have the "right" to exist but no mandate to exist. They're allowed to exist and just as allowed to collapse and dissolve
How is that a problem?
Moreso it's a contradiction in the original meme.
That's just not true. You just never learned what a nation is. Before there were nation-states, there were city-states. City-states were states that were confined to a city, geographically. So what is a nation then? It's not, as people think, an arbitrary border, a nation is a people with a shared history. French is a nation-state, a state that emerges from the nation of the French people, people who have a long history of being born in the same location, sharing the same language, and sharing many many cultural aspects.
America is not a nation, but it is a state. There are no American people. The land was inhabited by 100s of nations that did not organize themselves into states. That land was given the name of an Italian (Amerigo), and then a bunch of people of different nationalities invaded and occupied it. Same with all of the "Latin American" states, Australia, Canada, and the rest of the colonial world. There is no Australian nation, there is an Australian state populated by people of many different nations (the English nation, the Italian nation, the German nation, etc).
As far as I know, there are no nationless-states that aren't violent genocidal colonial projects. All of these states are illegitimate, based only on dominance with absolutely no other foundation.
All states should ultimately be dismantled, but the colonial states will need to go first, because otherwise the colonial states, history's most violent states, will be empowered by the dismantling of other states. There is an order to these things.
Everywhere on the planet has the right to exist, with the possible exception of Fresno, ca. And anywhere named after the political entity it exists in(new York city since the name change, California city, etc)
The regimes terrorizing the people into obedience, however; largely do not.
As an Australian I sometimes wonder what this place would be like if there hadn't been genocide and institutional racism for 200 years.
Emu supremacy
What makes you think it isn't already emu supremacy? Check the outcome of the emu war. They built bigger fences.
Due to the mineral wealth we don’t need to wonder much.
Australia… or whatever it would have been named, would have been a patchwork of dictatorships like we see in resource rich parts of Africa.
It’s actually really unusual that Australia didn’t end up that way.
Reporter: [REDACTED]
Reason: Fuck off with this racist, xenophobic shit.
Apparently decolonization is xenophobic.
I recently got banned from !Playstation@Lemmy.zip because I called out the moderator for crying about black people in God of War. The reason given? Racism, apparently, for telling the mod to stop being racist.
They deleted their account and locked the community, lol
Edit: to add on, a hexbear user saw that I got banned for "racism" after calling out the racist mod, and they also got banned, lmao. It's really funny, the mod edited their post and pretended they were a victim for "being called a bigot for standing against DEI in video games."
Such reactionary bullshit.
I mean, racism was technically the reason you got banned. Just not your racism lol
Average PlayStation user, tbh.
being called a bigot for standing against DEI in video games.
I love this response because thats still being bigoted.
This logic is what got me, for a brief period in my teens, to identify as an antisemite, because I genuinely thought that was just the word for people who think genocide is fucked and 'never again' sounds like a pretty good guideline.
And I'm terrified how many other kids bought into the Zionist propaganda since, and how many of them are going to be less willing to admit they made an oopsie than my dumb ass was. I'm terrified how many people are going to be hurt by second order Zionist violence, all over the world. I think when they start attacking language, a nuclear response is warranted.
Look down at our planet from the heavens above
See it as it is, see it as it is.
No borders or banks. No wars or tanks.
No nations. No nations!
"Fighting Song" by Outernational featuring Tom Morello
Counterpoint:
How beautiful is the north Korean sky? I bet it's unmatched
Here, "nation states" does not refer to the actual landmass their borders engulf, but rather to the abstract concept of differentiating between human populations on the basis of laws that merely exist within our minds and areas of land based on virtual lines that equally only exist in our minds
what exactly is your point? the fact that korea suffers inhumane sanctions imposed by the us empire with the goal of punishing the korean people for resisting their imperialism?
'cept most sane borders are based upon geography
You might think that no country has any right to exist but that belief wont protect you from someone who thinks their country should control the entire world.
Nationalism is a basic and maybe outdated mechanism that protects against foreign invasions. You need to understand its purpose and function if you want to abolish it. At some point, i think everyone would agree that some populations share certain moral values and priorities. And those values deserve to be defended.
You can call those values "Germany" or "EU" or "Europe" or "lemmy" or "lgbtq people of earth and nearby planets", but in the end you will have an entity that encapsulates values that are worth being defended. I dont give a fuck about my country and i wish daily that somehow it gets nuked out of existence. But fuck anyone who wants to take it over by force.
Why is all this important? We are entering an age where information warfare is crucial. If an entity can shield its population from enemy informational warfare(great firewall of China) while being free to use informational warfare against its enemies(tik tok or any social media), then you(in the West) will just become a useful idiot.
The enemy is trying to persuade that a thing is bad(countries/nationalism), while at the same time is preaching how great that same thing is on his own population. When the shit hits the fan, which side do you think will win? The one who thinks that nations are bullshit and no war is justified, or the country which thinks that its nation is the greatest and war is a moral necessity in order to "liberate" the rest of the world?
This is nothing new. Japanese imperialism was disguised as anti-western/anti-imperialistic. Japan was the sign that asian people can be equal/superior to europeans and they just wanted to spread their values and liberate other asian nations from the european/american shackles. You dont need to be a historian to realize how utterly bullshit this lie was. The germans did the same with the whole "honorary aryan" thing.
TLDR : Ask yourself, if you apply your belief, will the rest of the world follow? If not, who benefits from you applying your beliefs? Sometimes it is fine to have noble beliefs and realizing that they arent realistically applicable to the current world.
I'll have to remind the French and British settlers that died hundreds of years ago to knock it off the next time I see them.
Dig up their bones and send them to the British Museum
Sure, we didn't invade these countries but we maintain the colonial power structures and continue to benefit from colonisation as indigenous people continue to be dispossessed. It's easy and convenient to point your finger at the past and say thats where all the responsibility lies
I mean, depends on your definition of invasion. I have no problem calling British and French colonization of North America "invasion" but my main point is, Israel is actively doing it right now and all of the other countries listed did it hundreds of years ago where we can't reach them.
Stealing is not okay as soon as you give the stolen item to your kid. It should still be returned.
China give back Tibet, when?
Yeah but is the kid to blame?
Answer: no, but the kid should recognize inequity and help correct it anyway.
Sure, no state has a right to exist. Rights don't really exist either, for that matter. The issue with Israel isn't just being a colonist state, though. NZ is a colonial state. Awful things happened and continue to happen due to NZ colonisation. There is a pretty stark difference between race relations in NZ and Israel, however. When people rail against Israel it isn't solely on the basis of colonisation
Does anybody know when is gonna change Netanyahu the national anthem to "Israel uber alles"?
Get outta here with this false equivalence. The marginal human suffering inflicted per year caused by Israeli's colonialism is incomparably greater than any other country's in the modern era.
The US pays Israel to cause suffering
Okay granted. From this perspective, sure, American colonialism is strictly broader than Israel's. I don't think this really changes anything about what I'm saying here.
China says hi.
Remember when Apple.moved to India and tried to use the same conditions as their Non-Slave Chinese factories?
Remember when the Indian workers rioted over that?
Edit: fucking Google. Doesn't correct Infia to India, but automatically changes rioted to rooted.
Can you post a link to that Apple story? I’d like to educate myself on it
That's globalization, not colonialism. That's a completely different reason to want to see western powers annihilated.
Israel is certainly causing tremendous harm, but what you are saying is just blatant antisemitism. And you are obviously not up to date what happens in the world being so obsessed with demonizing Israel. Try to get a grip on reality again please.
antizionism != antisemitism.
To elaborate: I don't believe Israel's nationalistic sentiment is unique to Judaism. Israel could be a Christian state and could contain any ethnicity, its active colonialism would still be a problem.
What other country's active colonialism is anywhere near the level of Israel's?
Just because it isn't obviously genocidal(anymore) doesnt mean the US hasnt done incredible harm to the entire world. What israel is doing right now if horrific yes but the US is responsible for even greater suffering. Neither should exist
Seeing how Zionism is just a continuation of the Nazi's cleansing efforts, which was inspired by America's genocide, the US would very much be cupule in all of this if they weren't already the biggest donors to and defenders of its continued existence.
Bingo.
But sadly we live in reality and have to accept that talking about how the israeli people have just the same right to live as the palestinians is way more effective than outright demanding the abolishment of all nation states, a thing that, even if ever, is only going to become even fathomable to most humans in at least a few centuries
it's such a pleasant feeling having these "spells" break in your head. they shatter to the floor when you realize a state "not having a right to exist" makes no fucking sense to begin with.
Money and nations are as real as ghosts and gods
Excuse me while I go to your store and buy your choicest items with make-believe hand shadows art money.
I mean sure, no country technically has an inherent right to exist. But the difference is in the details. The US, Canada, etc, simply don't have that inherent right. Israel, in addition to that, only exists because of pity to a bunch of whiners and a (in retrospective bad) decision of everyone else to throw them a bone.
And pity that was displaced, it was founded by Nazi collaborators, not Holocaust victims!