Would you prefer if games had a separate difficulty setting for boss fights?

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45

That's actually what I tend to do, but would be nice (for laziness) to have two different settings. Or for cases where games don't allow adjustment after starting.

Funny you bring up Kena, because that is actually probably a prime example for me too. Loved the rest of the game, but the boss fights were a bit too difficult imo!

10

Around 2010, I remember this game studio sharing a innovative technique of game design where as people failed a boss battle, the game would slowly make the battle easier.

Some companies ran with it. Nintendo gives you extra help if you die multiple times in a level. Where some studios do it more behind the scenes. For example - giving you a bit more ammo. Or slowing the boss down a little more. I can't remember the game, but they have a feature where a boss can't one-shot you. And they give you more of that buff the more you die, so it "feels fair".

30

Making the boss easier after I die to it would frustrate the hell out of me unless it was optional. I want it to be a challenge, not just something I can beat if I die enough times.

23
- The best part is... You'd never know!
  
  A lot of these are only known years later, with devs sharing game design stories.
  
  7
- You'd have to die a few times to it too even notice it getting easier. Almost nobody wants to grind out a boss 20 times in order to beat it. And if properly done, the variables changed are so small each time, that it's not noticeable.
  
  It's a system to help everyone enjoy the game without quitting out of frustration. Because the majority of people, in general, quit after a bit too much resistance.
  
  There's a quick drop off of enjoyment when a player feels the game is too difficult.
  
  2
Zelda games have a neat scaling mechanism. If an idiot like me could beat the final boss in a couple tries, anyone can. And it’s super fun too.

2

Depending on the game I'd even do the opposite.

I don't care for the 20th fight against bandits to be hard - but a boss should feel like more of a challenge and take more time to finish.

27

In certain circumstances, I agree. I am currently playing The Outer Worlds RPG. In the game there is a companion quest which culminates in fighting a "Mantinqueen"- a giant monster space bug. There is a ton of build up to it. The monster had previously killed the companion's entire mercenary group. The lair was spooky and atmospheric.

Problem was, mantiqueens were creatures I'd already fought in the open world. I could demolish one is about a minute with my upgraded weapons. This made the boss fight underwhelming.

I wouldn't want the solution to be just tacking on more healthpoints, but there are other options to make the boss creature more interesting to fight and the game took none of them.

4
I'm playing Jedi: Survivor on story mode right now and this is exactly how I feel. It's a shame because even on story mode, boss fights in Fallen Order were still a little challenging.

3
Yeah I was going to say… in many cases bosses seem to be easier than the normal fights. The bosses sort of focus on being a novel gimmick with easily telegraphed attacks, which often ends up being easier than normal fights in some games.

1

I agree. I honestly hate boss battles. I love playing video games on hard mode, but for some reason boss battles have never filled my soul with joy or given me a sense of satisfaction when I'm done. They just irritate me. I definitely have games where I'm on the hardest difficulty for normal game play and then right before every boss battle I'm going into settings changing the difficulty to story mode so I can knock them down in 5 hits and move on with the game.

18

I've come to firmly believe that all games should have an invulnerability setting for the sake of accessibility. It's probably one of the easier settings to implement for most games and it would have the most impact for the wide range of accessibility needs out there.

16

I like Jedi: Survivor’s method of accessibility. They let you slow down the game if you need a little more leeway with the bosses. You can crank that slider down to like 10% speed and it’s like being Neo in that scene where he dodges bullets. You can still fuck up but it’s pretty easy. I used it for the platforming because I hate platforming so much.

6
Agreed, I think the first game I saw this in was Tunic. It was a great addition!

5
- Control for me! It was mind blowing. Not a difficult game but it really improved my ability to enjoy the game at some points.
  
  7
That's called cheating, and there's usually a way to do it in most games.

-10
- If it's pvp then sure it's cheating but why would it be cheating for a single player game? Isn't the point to have fun?
  
  13

That is a question where the answer is very complex. You'd have to break down different game design philosophies, think them through, and then apply them to specific games.

In general, I have two gut reactions:

If players are desiring to change the difficulty of the bosses compared to the rest of the game, the devs have to ask if there is a failure of design on their part. An example of this would be Dues Ex Human Revolution, which was an immersive sim that supported many different character builds, except the boss fights which were entirely based on combat. This created a frustrating and unfair situation to players not making a combat built character. The solution was that the boss fights were completely redesigned in the Director's Cut release to support alternate builds. This is one example, but naturally there are many more. If a game has a "that boss", the devs should look at it and examine if there is a problem with the design. Is a battle too comparatively difficult? Too tedious? Only suitable for certain builds (in games with builds)? Is the battle too much of a departure from standard gameplay in the rest of the game?
A popular game is going to get mods. If there is a strong desire in the player base, the mod is going to happen regardless of dev stubbornness, so devs may as well just give the people what they want. If a game is praised but has outcry for boss difficulty sliders, either put it in officially or incorporate it into the sequel.

14

Yeah that's relatable.

#Adultgamers

14

Right? When I was a kid I would specifically enjoy the "challenge" of trying to beat something over and over. Nowadays though... I just like playing a game for the experience. I still like feeling "progression", so things go from difficult to easy as my character advances. But having to repeat something multiple times? Eh... just not my jam anymore.

11
- As a kid I enjoyed the cheats. As an adult? I way way prefer the challenge.
  
  12
- I used to feel like I didn't get my money's worth until I beat a game. That quickly fell out. I just measure a game's worth by my enjoyment of it now.
  
  1

Super Mario Bros Wonder threads this needle expertly, in my opinion.

Each level has a difficulty rating from 1 to 5 stars with 1 being easiest and 5 being "Mario Hard."

To complete the main story, you only really need to beat mostly the easier levels, like difficulty 1-3 stars. All other levels are really optional, but there are a lot of them, and they are the 4-5 stars level difficulty.

So the "main game" by default should be "easy enough" for most gamers, and for those who want a challenge, there are tons of extra challenges for them to pursue.

I think I prefer this to a "difficulty setting" because it allows both casual and hardcore gamers to approach the same game in different ways. It doesn't make you feel like you are missing anything from either way you choose to play. It also allows you to practice the harder levels if you want to get better.

Some games like Halo, if I recall correctly, literally rewarded you with special cutscenes for the hardest difficulty in beating the game. That can leave players who "aren't good enough" for such high difficulty to feel a bit left out.

I don't feel the same about Super Mario Bros Wonder, it just feels pretty accessible to all and I think more companies need to attempt something similar.

11

Some games like Halo, if I recall correctly, literally rewarded you with special cutscenes for the hardest difficulty in beating the game. That can leave players who "aren't good enough" for such high difficulty to feel a bit left out.

Those players can either youtube it or keep trying.

I beat Reach on SLASO (minus the skull that hides your gun and HUD after the first level) and it would have been less satisfying if the game made it easier when I died.

2
Another thing Wonder does well with difficulty is letting the yoshis be invulnerable and less complex (no form change).

2
- I forgot to mention that! Yeah the nigh invulnerability for struggling players is a huge help.
  
  2

I prefer games that use reactionary difficult (idk what the proper term is) where the difficulty changes based on how well you do.

Kicking too much ass? Here's more enemies and they hit harder.

Getting gangbanged at every turn? Fewer enemies and they're easier to kill.

This seems like the best way to make sure everyone playing has a fun experience

7

I don't know if I want to be punished for doing well

6
I'm the complete opposite. I don't want to feel like the game is letting me win. I want to earn it, at least a little.

6
I hate that. Nothing is more enraging than dying and having the loading screen say something like "hey, it looks like you suck, do you want to go back to normal difficulty?" No, no I don't. Difficulty is part of the enjoyment fot me, having a feature that takes it out of my control would be a turnoff.

1
This has a bad tendency to backfire badly. Really badly.

A lot of players like to do "save summing" (save often and reload if it doesn't go well). With doing this, the game only moves forward when you are winning, so the game gets harder and harder since it thinks you are really "good" at the game. It ends up making players quit in frustration from the gaming being too hard and "unfair".

This was a huge issue for (mostly PC) players of the original Max Paine, since people weren't aware of this auto adjusting difficulty.

Resident Evil didn't have this issue because of limited saves (and when you died, it would offer to load the save for you, so it could monitor your death count.)

1

Sure, I'm generally in favour of more options when feasible. Hell, if someone wants to skip 90% of a single player game, more power to them. Hell, any non-competitive online game too, though I doubt many publishers would consider not charging extra for it…

6

Fuck before even that, they should fix and put and easy mode on all games. Why can't the lazy devs even to fkin that for accessibility.

4

I really hate FromSoft for the utter lack of a difficulty slider in all of the Souls games.

I don't have the time to grind their games to "git gud" like they want. Just let me enjoy the game instead of wanting to pull my hair out as I play.

I've essentially wasted $120 on Dark Souls 3 and Elden Ring because I hear nothing but utter praise for them. Then I realized I didn't have the time or patience to grind out those boss fights, so I get <10 hours of play time out of them before I have to stop.

2
- You could just do more research before buying a game at full price and being mad that the game isn't for you. If you want a story those games aren't for you. There's more story in YouTube videos about the game than what's actually upfront in the game. I understand being upset at a bad purchase but adding a difficulty slider is counter to the developers intent and thus not made for you.
  
  5
- Saying dark souls/elden ring is not easy enought is like saying schindlers list isnt funny enought. You are missing the point of the whole thing.
  
  Besides. There are always ways to make something easier in from games. A spell, a item, some armor. And that is by design.
  
  Best example is the taurus deamon in dsk1. You find an item before the boss room. Use the item and the thing is done in two seconds. Of course it is also posdible to brute force it with dodge skills.
  
  I think the one thing people dont get about from games ist that they are as much detective games as they are action rpgs.
  
  3
- If you're on PC you could try looking for some mods to help alleviate the things you don't like. But yes, it would be nice to have more options right out of the box.
  
  3
- If you are on PC you can download cheat engine and a table for the game. This will allow you to turn on invincibility if you just wish to explore at your leisure.
  
  1
Even the ones that have an easy mode need to make sure it's not a too easy mode. Doom Eternal was horrible for that. In normal mode, you'd die in 3 to 4 hits, but in easy mode it took 10-12. So normal was too hard for many people (like myself, don't have the time to "git gud") and easy mode took all the challenge and fun out of it. And when I looked it up, it was a common complaint.

1

Yeah, also a way to skip certain missions in older GTA games. I usually play games on easy because I have a low tolerance for frustration. Hence, I tend to avoid souls-likes, etc, although I would love to play them.

3

My reasoning is that I already have a job, and I need my games to feel like fun, not work. I want a challenge, not a slog.

7
"All you had to do was follow the damn train, CJ!"

4
- People always complain about this because they blocked out the trauma of the RC plane missions. Those were 1000x worse.
  
  1
I think there is a wide difference between soulslikes and GTA. The most obvious being that soulslikes are understood to be difficult, while GTA difficulty spikes are almost random and tend to be a result of poor design.

In something like GTA there shouldn't be a need to skip story critical missions, because those mission should be ironed out. The really frustrating missions either need to be reworked or pushed into optional side missions.

2

I wouldn't mind but I also maybe wouldn't use it. Even though I'm with you. Boys fights are fine set pieces but not really my favorite part most the time. I've had ribs of fun with with ring and DS3, but what I like about then is the setting, exploration, and tension moving from bonfire to bonfire.

I'm stubborn though and would have a hard time convincing myself that it's ok to decrease the difficulty and not cheating/missing out on the intended game.

3

Would be nice if there was a dynamic difficulty that constantly changes based on how well your performing. You can always have a hard fought and be victorious but just barely to have a great experience. Would need a different implementation to have some penalty or reduce reward for not performing well so you will be motivated to try your best. Although properly implementing that is definetely a difficult task but seems possible enough to hope for. The closest thing I can imagine is hades that gradually increases damage resistance each time you die and I really like that implementation for a rougelike. I am someone who likes a bit of challenge but will definitely lose interest if I have to repeat something multiple times. Hades is an exception as each runs varies a lot but soulslike game that you have to try multiple times to learn and defeat a boss is a massive turn off for me.

3

I'd like to skip them all together. They are often gimmicky and tiresome.

3

To me this seems like solving the wrong problem. Ever since Souls, too many games get obsessed about making their boss encounters challenging but making the main level gameplay just tedious filler. AC6 missions often feel like that. Imho the correct action is to refine the gameplay and figure out your core loop, instead of having massive difficulty spikes.

This is the gameplay equivalent of the "Whisper and Explosion" problem.

3

I did this with Ghosts of Tsushima. I played on hard mode but when I dueled against other samurai I often dropped to easy mode after getting destroyed fifteen or twenty times

2

Totally depends on the game. Some games, like Ratchet and Clank Size Matters, yes for the final boss. Games like Brok The InvestiGator, no because I found the combat easy on the hardest difficulty.

2

I have the opposite issue, so yes. I don't particularly enjoy having to constantly pay attention to every enemy, but I enjoy learning a boss fight for an hour or two. I've also played a few games where dealing with random enemies felt harder than dealing with bosses due to sheer numbers, and it would help with that too.

So I don't think it's really a design problem. If you know exactly what you want your game's experience to be, then don't add it. But I'd argue for most games it isn't integral to the experience how the difficulty of normal mobs vs bosses compares, and people have different preferences for it.

2

I think my preference would be to have the game offer to reduce the difficulty temporarily after failing or offer other forms of support to make the boss encounter easier. If I selected Hard then I probably want the challenge of Hard, but if this difficulty spike is too much, then smoothing it out could be acceptable.

This is also ideally in addition to a way to adjust the difficulty mid-game as needed, of course.

2

I think, a lot of games adjust the difficulty when you loose too many times. Don't ask how I know...

0

What if you tighten?

3

It would be nice to have, but hard to implement IMO

0

Not really. You just use whatever difficulty scaling value you'd use for "easy" for specific enemies/encounters.

2
- It's trivial to change variables like health and damage. Does it make for a nuanced difficulty slider? No. But it's better than nothing.
  
  The more accessibility-focused devs could change enemy spawn rates, attack speeds, attack patterns, enemy spawn types, and many more.
  
  Inclusivity is never a bad thing.
  
  1

No that makes no sense lol

-1