Wi-Fi jamming to knock out cameras suspected in nine Minnesota burglaries -- smart security systems vulnerable as tech becomes cheaper and easier to acquire

I'm hard pushing my family and friends to replace/install POE switches currently. Its a minor cost upgrade that will make my life so much easier

Heck yeah. In addition to POE, I’ve got a power line adapter setup to the NVR so that the cams are all hardwired to the modem/router combo. It’s fast enough for remote viewing in HD.

Some of them even have solar panels as well. It's very useful if you want to DYI installation without having to run cables all over the place (data and/or power).

This Wi-Fi jamming stuff does seem like a huge issue. I was actually considering wireless down the line, but maybe a system with proper wired connections would be better.

Trash passive IR motion detection.

Have wireless setup, works really well. If they want it that bad they can have it while I'm gone or risk their life while I'm there.

I mean ethernet has a range of 100 meters in one run (including with POE), which is probably going to be longer than the WiFi range assuming the WiFi access point is at the switch and it's a relatively straight run. If you need more range a small 4 port POE switch is hardly likely to break the bank if you have a property big enough to need over 100 meters of ethernet in one run.

Isn't there ethernet over power or something like that?

I use a reolink poe doorbell camera. It's a bitch to replace your doorbell wire with Ethernet but it's really worth it for the zero lag and camera still working during a power outage because my server is on a UPS. plus the wires can be used for a traditional doorbell if I sell the house, I just pick a pair and power them.

Ring has a PoE doorbell. Expensive though

Just because they are popular and cheaper doesn't mean it's a good idea.

See also: Bathtub inserts, countertop veneers, cheap EIFS stucco, overlay roofing, etc.

I don't disagree with that. If someone wants in they're coming in. 100% agreed. The trick is making your self less of an easy target and cutting down on easy ins.

My statement was pretty generic as there is a lot of nuance to locks and security. My concern lies mostly with the fact that you rarely have a suitable blending of the two technologies. Either a lock company buying a kit or an electronics company buying bulk locks. Or a company that does neither and is looking for another thing to peddle on Amazon.

Some of these locks have very poorly positioned relays. You can unlock them with a magnet. Others can be actuated using a simple emf generator. Ones with passcodes can be read with consumer grade ir sensors or determined by wear and fingerprints.

Reducing attack vectors is always preferred. But it is absolutely up to the end user where their balance between convenience and security lies.

A good deadbolt and key while average is still superior as it is only 3ish attack vectors: pick or impression, destruction of door/lock, and the trusty rock:

Most doors have poorly placed windows with standard glass in or next to them.

They busted the door off the hinges when they broke into my house once. One of your doors is an open in door... those are kick in doors as the guy was telling me when he replaced mine.

Smart locks are worse. They have all the insecurity of a regular lock, plus more methods of insecurity, plus more failure modes that will shut you out of your house.

Most smartlocks have a bypass lock for power cuts etc. that is shockingly easy to pick.

I don't love somewhere where people dress up as Scooby Doo villains to break into houses, I live in a place where people go house to house at 1 am and try door handles on cars and garages. A motion light and a camera does more to stop those people than anything else.

If someone wants to stage an organized heist, then yea, my camera isn't doing shit, but neither are my door locks, or a bolted down safe. At that point it is just an insurance game.

Was it It Takes A Thief? I remember that show; it was actually pretty interesting

Low tech solution sure - you need to walk up to the camera and would need the location of any cameras that would potentially catch you as you scooter around tagging the cameras. Advantage is you are 100 sure the cam can't see you.

Deauth attacks work very well and don't require you to nuke all of the wireless space.

There's a variety of different attacks. Admittedly destroying the camera is more or less a sure thing hah.

You're right that you should try to make yourself a less appealing target for thrives, but some of your methods don't really hold up to scrutiny. Beeping motion sensor lights and secure locks and doors are great ideas. They will absolutely deter casual thrives and addicts.

Advertising that you have guns is just advertising that you have something to steal that is valuable, easy to sell, and easy to carry.

Warning signs for dogs aren't much better. If you don't have a dog, that will usually become obvious to anyone close enough to read the sign. If you do have a dog, then the sign is just an invitation to have them murdered the next time you have to interact with police at home. It will also expose you to liability should any trespasser be injured by that dog. Yeah, even the person robbing you, but also children, other pets, and well meaning innocent people just doing their jobs (and not breaking the law by entering your property without permission) like meter readers, mailmen, land surveyors, emergency response, etc. When I see a dog warning sign, to me it just says that a dumb asshole abusing a dog lives here.

Broken furniture sounds clever, but that just says trashy, not poor. Actual poor people take better care of their shit. HOAs would also limit the places you could actually do this without fines in the suburbs. Broken outdoor furniture is as common as weeds in more rural areas.

WiFi Cams just mean that you can afford Internet. EVERYBODY has WiFi cameras. They are ridiculously cheap to buy and easy to install. Cameras (WiFi or not) aren't a great deterent anyway.

DO NOT put gun signs/stickers up. It's an ongoing joke that a Glock sticker on a truck means "free gun inside".

That's an interesting take, and I think I might agree with you.
Solid-looking boring lock, everything looking like it would last decades, looks like someone who sorted the security confidently.
Plastic looking wifi cameras everywhere have a "curtain twitchy granny" vibe.

Every single person in your neighbourhood has multiple cameras?! Where do you live?

That's because you aren't one of the owner class. The legally supported armed thugs don't protect the citizenry. They protect the owners private and personal property. Your personal property isn't worth protecting in their eyes.

I personally have many zigbee devices that I operate happily, but most entry devices by big names (e.g. Google, Amazon, Wyze) and smart-home appliances (think garage door openers, light/fan fixtures, laundry machines, ect.) end up being WiFi. Even if you're a self-sufficient homelabber who buys all zigbee and self-hosted devices, it's hard not to end up with a bunch of WiFi devices anyway.

And if you have a spouse who is less knowledgeable, it can be really hard to explain or justify the higher expense for something like a security camera, or dissuade them from buying a smart fan they really like because it uses an external WiFi connection for its smart features.

Zwave is great too, but still no video. Wired is the answer.

then don’t do that ¯(ツ)_/¯

Sure, but still harder to do than wifi

Yeah, i always try to connect as much as I can to ethernet cables. The issue being that it's sometimes a pain to install the cables, especially if you're renting and can't really pass wires through walls

I always find it a bit amusing when I see "shut down due to radar activity" in my 5GHz logs.

gdo's? = God Damned Operators?

I use hikvision and the quality is great in low light. I haven't connected them to the internet since I use Frigate and Home Assistant to monitor the feeds.

I've been happy with Hikvision recording to my Qnap NAS. I've heard some bad ethical things about their company, but the cam works well.

Check out Reolink, they have a lot of package systems and lots of deals. Watch some videos on the installation process.

I've set family up with a lorex system, setup was pretty straightforward and it works well. No monthly subscription fees rock.

UniFi Protect is outstanding. You need to buy one of their NVRs or cloud gateways to use it, but it's incredible & wouldn't want another system for our house/family business

They’re essentially the same, but you only need to run one wire to them instead of two. The PoE means you don’t need to worry about getting power to the camera, which historically has been one of the more expensive parts of installation; It usually means tying into existing electrical boxes if they’re nearby, or pulling new lines if they’re not. But with PoE, everything is on that one cable.

There’s also the advantage that a networked system can be controlled remotely. Things like pan/tilt/focus/etc can be remotely controlled via Ethernet. So if you have configuration options with the camera, you don’t need to physically access it with a ladder just to make those adjustments.

As for the actual video, it’s not much different; Everything lands at a centralized hub, which then records the video or streams it to a remote server, which then records it. There are advantages and disadvantages to either, and it’s typically advised to do both. Because with a local server, once a thief gets physical access to it, they can do whatever they want with it. You were relying on that video footage, but now it’s useless because the thief took all of your hard drives. With a remote system, the big disadvantage is that it’s reliant on your internet connection. So all a potential thief has to do is cut the line going into your house.

For a truly “secure” system, the general consensus is two local servers and a remote server. Have one local server accessible, in something obvious like a server rack. Then have another redundant server somewhere else, which is more hidden and more difficult to access. And put power backups on those local servers, so they can’t simply cut the power at your breaker panel. The hope is that even if they cut your internet and/or power, and destroy the first local server, you still have the second local server. This is notably easier to do with a PoE system, due to the aforementioned lack of power runs to the cameras. Just put your network on the power backup, and the cameras will continue to function even after the power is cut. But that’s hella expensive, and would typically be reserved for enthusiasts, paranoid apocalypse preppers, and/or rich people.

Easier and cheaper to install and maintain.

Only needs a single cable that can come from any PoE switch.

CCTV is just out-dated.

Digital. Can use regular computer as recorder.

Surprised they haven't got them based on powerline (running a slightly worse ethernet though the electric lines). That way you'd still only need the one cable, and be able to lock people into your own powerline ecosystems.

More like throw it in the trash when gooogle decides it's obsolete and bricks it for "security concerns"

Painful how true that is. It's awful.

At least some doorbell cameras power themselves off the doorbell power supply, so it's not all devices with battery. Still more than should exist though.

If you are in the middle of a frame-off gut of a home, as I currently am, much of this is trivial to implement.

Even my parent’s 1978 home, with it’s drop ceiling in the basement, would not make most of this all that much more difficult.

Right, and always remember they’ll go for the easy win first. First choice is likely walk in an unlocked door, then kick in one not visible from the street, or if you really want in, break a window.

The thing is, even if you get a good shot of the person doing it, it probably can’t help find the person, only prove that it was them, if you find a suspect.

A better use is to get that early warning of what is happening as soon as it happens, and get a response going, but what’s the response time from your local police department? A smash and grab gets them on their way with your valuables, with very little chance of police getting there on time

That’s when we’re back to physical security and it may not be what you think. Can you reinforce your lock plate and door jamb to make it difficult, noisy, and time consuming to kick in a door? Are there windows they can easily get in and what can you do about that? Are there hidden places where they can break in without being seen? If a light suddenly comes on or alarm goes off, will they leave in case someone looks?

If I got an alarm every time a 433 sensor didn't check in for 10 minutes, I'd never get any sleep!

fucking wasps cause 100x more false alarms than network issues for me. I need a neural net or something that can differentiate between a wasp and a human.

No. They're talking about the jammers getting cheap and easy to get. Cheap wifi security cameras have been a thing for over a decade now. Then got stupid dirt cheap in 2017 when wyze started selling one for $20.

More of a boil situation. Nothing's getting golden brown and delicious in this scenario.

https://files.catbox.moe/ivcy5y.gif

Depends on where and how far. Once youre trenching and cutting into your walls, it's only cheap if youre spending your time.

The cost of the cable maybe, not the cost of all the ancillary work.

Most people have or want cameras in places where it won't be particularly easy to run wires, like door frames for door bells, and outside walls with insulation and various utilities in the way.

Other people live where they can't do it at all (an apartment)

I think he meant relative cost (including time)

Power-over-Ethernet

Thanks for replying. I am going to install some wired cameras.

Well, an emp is so.ething to be worried, nor usual but it could happen. Maybe a Faraday cage could help minimize the impact.

A spray paint or masking tape will have better, immediate effect.

Not if it's wired. But the same could probably be said for wired ip cameras