1y ago

Divide and rule

145 comments

I read "brutish" as "british" on first glance
- More often than not that has been the case :)
  
  Much less often than not, by a colossal margin. They did have a good run, though.
- Same, and I was like well if the shoe fits...
  
  you must acquit
- I can't find any differences
- Which surprisingly does not change the meaning as much, as one would think it would.
- If you ever need to check, this site has up to date information. https://arethebritsatitagain.org
  
  Are the brits a tit again
- Considering the behavior of British tourist globally today, or even the history of their empire, the two words may as well have the same meaning.
  
  I can only apologise for my fellow countrymen. They're pricks, especially a group of lads or the typical Gammon family unit, and it's why I try to holiday in places with as few of them as possible.

This feels dangerously close to some EnlightenedCentrism nonse
- I'm not sure whether the version of this I saw previously was the original and this post was cropped, or if this post is the original and the other text was added later. But I much prefer the context here:
  
  Ahh see this I can get behind, reminds me of the Soviet anti alcohol poster that's become a meme too
  Good original intent, less good modern applications
  The dawn of nationalism was definitely the mistake of the previous age I think. Peoples should be able to self govern autonomously, but not under a guise of "the nation" which inherently forms an out group to be excluded.
  I like the Arabic/American way to do it, "You wanna be one of us? Well then you're already half way there!"
  I speak very little Arabic but my teacher has told me that I already know enough to get the long list cousin's welcome among most L1 speakers lol.
- Yeah i've learned not to trust this kind of simmetrical worldview, even when it makes me feel smart for being above it.
  
  What if instead of taking it as saying all things are symmetrical we take it to mean that we have a tendency to consider outsiders to be "savage" or simply "other" even when the evidence doesn't support that? Then this shitpost would be more like a warning against xenophobia.
  You chose an interpretation you didn't like just so you could dismiss it. And you don't think your goal in doing so is to feel intellectually superior? You're another.
- Hmmm it's almost as if politics and ethics are very nuanced and one answer is never correct in every situation..
  
  One side thinks the answer is "do fascism", so I think it may be fair to conclude that one of the proposed answers is at least wrong in every situation.
  
  One faction has a messiah fixation, thumps a Bible they've never even read (they just let some pastor tell them what's in it), obsesses over guns and other peoples' private (by which I mean sexual) lives and reproductive organs. They've been told and so believe that Sodom and Gomorrah was about the sex, but it was about righteousness and hospitality - and these are two things that they themselves lack completely.
  There is a real problem, a real danger, because it fits historical patterns we've seen before - the so-called "ideas" that they spout with the language that they use - and they end up mindlessly, senselessly bringing EVERYBODY down with them.
  They are a menace to all of us. Including themselves, but they don't see it. And neither does the "both sides" argument, a lazy excuse for not acknowledging that the proverbial emperor has no clothes.
- What do you mean?
  
  It is quite literally implying "both sides actually same!"
  
  Because it isn't always true? Sometimes you government just has regular levels of suck while the other government is really awful. I am confident that the South Korean government has room for improvement I am not willing to put them on the same level as North Korea. Plus you can look at migration flows. There is a reason why some countries have people willing to risk death to get into and other countries people are trying to get out of.
- no, you're just so lost in years of political memes that you can't understand a simple point anymore. this isn't about fuckin Russia or fascism or the election. it's about demonizing and polarizing our equals. and you've clearly eaten that fuckin bait in one bite, you're experiencing so much cognitive disonancia that you can't even see beyond your own petty politics and just worry that OMG SOMEONE ISNT CALLING THE THING I DONT LIKE A BAD THING ITS BAD BAD BAD CMON thats this entire fucking thread and the entire political landscape around here, no I'm not okay and none of you are. I'm so fucking sick of internet politics and everyone's fucking unnuanced cliches and worthless calls to arms
  
  Good God it's like I can hear how white you are!
  That's a pretty easy opinion to have when that "difference of opinions" isn't over your right to live and be considered a full human with full and equitable human rights.
  This sounds more like you're lashing out because someone NCed you after getting tired of your peacekeeper complex moving you to try and shut them up whenever they were getting into it with the weird uncle at Thanksgiving because "you're the reasonable one come on please just take the high road here!"
  
  Ok Putin
  
  Ok Russian bot.
  (I'm kidding don't crucify me) :P

I feel like the artist originally wanted to make this primarily medieval themed. But then realisied "Oh yeah, news and stuff are a thing." And then just added laptops and antennas.
- It’s been added on to. The original didn’t have the radio towers or “time out” area
- Someone shared a different version that doesn't have those newer stuff. That might've been the original.
  https://lemmy.ca/comment/7948433
  
  via https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/our-blessed-homeland-their-barbarous-wastes
  https://twitter.com/tomgauld/status/571994690289061888 is the original
- The font is slightly different as well
  
  True. It's very obvious when you look at the "E".

Are there disinformation campaigns from the EU targeting the russian population?
- No but englightened centralism means facts don't matter.
  
  I see this as more anti-nationalism than any kind of centrism.
- If there isn't, they need to step up their shit.
- Not European, but there's Voice of America: Russian, which was originally headed by Richard Carlson from 1986 to 1991. You might not recognize Dick, but his son Tucker is also a fixture in the media business.
- I bet there are, just a matter of scale and effectiveness.
  There's an organization that sneaks usb drives to North Korea. Full of news, shows, articles etc all hand picked by former NK citizens that defected
  
  But is it disinformation?
  Spreading information is not the same as spreading lies.
- "Hmm here's a situation I arbitrarily picked out where this message doesn't apply, therefore the message is useless to all situations. And anyone who says otherwise is supporting the bad guys of my arbitrary situation" - literally all of you

I think about this whenever I see legislative efforts to "prevent disinformation" XD
I hate disinformation as much as the next guy, but we gotta be careful who we give charte blanche to censor information XD

PURPLE GOOD YELLOW BAD 😤😤
- Typical sense of entitlement from a purple, they're all the same, that primitive purple brain can't comprehend other light waves exist.

It's worth pointing out that the two opposing countries / nations / city states in this cartoon would have to have similar governments with similar charters, and similar selection processes for their representatives.
It is lunacy to say things like "Obummer was a dictator!" when he was selected twice by people voting, and then peaceably left the office after his two terms completely in line with the Constitution.
Now can you say the same thing about, for instance, Putin?
- It's important to follow the laws of the land, otherwise there is damage to the system. Legal framework, electoral framework, political framework. So when answering your question about Putin, the electoral rules and legalities of Russia's system must be examined. Were they violated?
  That is also a question on the US national agenda for Trump. It is important to consider his case in context of the system. And to compare his real estate dealings to others who deal in real estate. What was the severity and nature of the alleged crime? Are these kinds of behaviors common in the American political class?

What I get from this image is that one side will call the other side evil while the other side will do the same
It's best to look at the actions of a person or group rather than what they state they are doing
- well apparently people around here lose their shit if you recognize that judgments aren't objective facts. so fucking annoying
  
  Maybe we are tired of Putin bootlickers

More moronic both sides shit?
- Class: Say the line, Bart!
  Bart: This is whataboutism

Nation-states were a bad idea
- Alternatives?
  I see 2:
  full hegemonic domination of one nation state where everyone gets their basics met. Star trek style.
  intense local tribalism where you're doing a whole lot more defending your land than you are now
  
  Or maybe there’s a dozen alternatives that could work better and both of us are staring at this from the bottom of a pro-hierarchy well that we’ve been stuck in ever since one guy convinced another one he should be in charge.
  I don’t have a full solution, I just want us to be flexible enough to figure one (or more) out.
  “The international ideal unites the human race”
  
  anarchism, i.e. bottom-up democracy and federal structures. Read up on Rojava for example.
  
  I'd go for the second, with pleasure. Better spend my time fighting for hometown than working for a big profit-driven company.
- They make sense, as they were good enough to stop imperial empires from ravaging the world. But their limits are a governing forces are seen today.
  I do think the age of nation-states are ending soon, and the rise of a new type of state may happen soon. Maybe something like a culture-state?

There is a reason the Geneva Convention (and the Hague protocols before it) prohibit assassination. That reason is that the Glorious Leader and the Wicked Despot have more in common with each other than they do with us peons. Don't anyone get too excited during our "war" (population reduction, economic stimulus package, domestic troubles distraction). Invest in defense contractors, the elite will keep them fed.
Remember the average dude in China, Iran, Russia, etc is no more interested in dying to aggrandize his rich owners than you are.
- Remember the average dude in China, Iran, Russia, etc is no more interested in dying to aggrandize his rich owners than you are.
  True, and you also have to remember that many of them have it ingrained in their culture to hate enough to kill gays, other religious people, races, etc.
  Despite how much people love to say one culture isn't better than any other... There absolutely are if you're looking through a lens of equality. Particularly if you've grown up in a more westernized nation where non-perfect progress has been made on those points.
  Let's just hope the west doesn't continue turning into Yallqaeda and all the lost Fascists suddenly earn a Herman Cain award.

Make Purple Great Again!

Rule of the world. The most violent ape gets to continue his lineage. To continue to pretend that we're more than violent apes is naive.
- Come on, you know that creatures who evolved the capacity for linguistic communication adapted to external forces with more than just greater and greater violence. We're not whispering cobras. We're creatures that demand community. The reason we even feel emotions like shame and love is to bond us together as a tribe for greater protection.
  
  The reason we even feel emotions like shame and love is to bond us together as a tribe for greater ~~protection~~ violence.
  FTFY.
- The most violent ape probably got murdered once he pissed off enough other apes. But the ape that used violence strategically is probably the ancestor of today's leaders.
  
  That's an incredible point. Intelligence allowed violence to be used more strategically.

"Shogun" tackles this really well.

America is equally as bad as Russia! /s

Except that,
Our objective news - is really just a mess of different slants, some being propaganda, that are not censured even when their content approaches slander due to heavy political bias.
Our combating disinformation - is largely unexisting to the point that several large social media providers have abolished or acted against the control they had for doing so and that their CEOs shamelessly meet with presidential candidates with ties to them.
Our glorious leader - is hardly accepted as a glorious leader and the portion of the society that does also tend to have absolutely no qualms about becoming more authoritarian by their own admission.
Our great religion - is criticized within the country and an increasing number of people are becoming atheists.
Our noble populace - Our heroic adventures - Ok, who is writing this meme? Who thinks their society thinks this way? Half the other populace disagrees with the other half, even going so far as to be described as hate, and any mythos of heroic is easily dismissed the moment it becomes convenient to do so not to mention the amount of criticism armed forces get.
This is whataboutism 101. Not all sides are completely black and white, but not all sides are equally grey.
- I don't think this comic was about you or your country. It's about how nationalists frame things in their own vs. other countries.
  
  Except that at least nationalists can be criticized in mine, creating such a mess in a first place. In theirs, if not explicit social censorship, there's clear persecution of the barest opposition.
- The whole point is that the two nations are the same, but some of the population doesn't see it that way. Of course our news is filled with propaganda, that's what this meme is saying. Of course our troops are carrying out the whims of a despot. But blind nationalism paints these as the right and true path.
  
  Funny thing, at least we get to criticize it. They don't.
- nice job writing an essay on completely missing the point
  
  Nice job joining the block list

I mean I would rather be caught dead than be purple

This and the rabbit/duck flag.

It is divide and conquer vs. unite and rule. You don't rule over people about to go at each other.
Whatever this things reeks of both sideism. Which is another way to feel superior without learning.

145 comments