Nothing could possibly go wrong
Nothing could possibly go wrong
Nothing could possibly go wrong
So I guess you’d have to either fill up your trailer with gas or charge it. Now that’s two vehicles you have to power, which kind of defeats the purpose of towing anyway.
It seems a better solution would be a PHEV with a large battery and a range extender for when you need to tow....why on earth do this?
I could see this working if it was hardwired to the lead vehicle for data over a wire and that would also include a safety tether. Since it seems to be aimed at EV owners, give it a big ass battery and allow it to share power with the lead car to extend the range of the pair. If the trailer give you longer range on your road trips, let you have one plug to charge both vehicles at each charge stop, and had a safety tether and did the data wired rather than wirelessly, I could see some rich folks springing for it. As advertised it sounds like a bad joke from a b rated 90s scifi movie
Fuck it. Why not just get a little steering wheel and a little person to drive your little tow truck behind you? No need to worry about losing Wi-Fi signal.
I can see the theoretical benefit, but yeah, I wouldn't trust it.
If you're a person with a car with no hauling capabilities, and no one to borrow a truck or van from, this should be a nice solution.
But yeeeaaaah, no thanks.
Electric vehicles lose a lot more range when towing than diesel vehicles, and they take longer to charge.
This would be a good option for a family that has an EV, but doesn't want to drive an 8,000# EV day to day, just needs the extra juice when towing.
You could use an EV motor home, but then if you wanted a smaller vehicle with to drive around at your destination, you'd have to either drive that separately, or town that vehicle.
This is a solution for people to have a single, smaller EV that can bring an existing travel trailer for vacation.
This is EXACTLY the type of thing that would help prevent people from "needing" an F-350 for day to day driving, cause they have a trailer they use twice a year.
Couldn't you instead add a massive battery to the trailer and physically connect both it and the trailer to the car. Essentially letting you tow a battery bank with extra storage? Like that you mitigate having to work out the safety issues and you don't have to pay for another set of motors etc.
You could upsell it by the trailer being extra battery for when you're camping f.ex.. And it could be modular, accepting a camping to / flatbed/ whatever.
Of course it takes longer to charge. Who charges a diesel vehicle?
/s just in case.
I think a way better solution would be to just borrow a bigger car for those two days a year.
Everyday, car engineers move closer to the ultimate form of transportation: the train.
If trains are so great why is everyone smoking crack on them
Let’s make more vehicles with a single purpose, this will save the environment. One set of wheels and a motor is not complicated enough. We need two sets of those and A motherfucking I to achieve the same thing farmers did as soon as tractors were invented.
What problems does this bullshit solve?
This is actually almost environmentally motivated. Instead of driving a pickup truck because you need to pull a trailer for your once a year road trip, you get a self driving tow to follow your fuel efficient compact car.
The idea sounds neat for trucks, where one driver could lead a whole fleet of AI trucks in some kind of a road train. But even then there's a whole load of problems e.g. with people overtaking on the oncoming lane or if there's enough space after the intersection for some of the trucks but not all of them. But for RV's? That's dumb AF.
Early tractors were more domesticated than invented..
It's a way around length limits. Towing a giant-ass rv with a giant-ass boat and a giant-ass trailer full of toys all at once? No need to tow triples and be 180 feet long. Just use some of these bastards.
To be honest it has more utility for commercial trucks
Only real use I can imagine, is for having a whole convoy of individually towed trailers, so you can transport multiple trailers with one trip.
But yeah, for personal use, that's far too niche for them to actually build this. I imagine, they're working on the same technology for linking lorries/trucks into big convoys and figured, they'd invest the tiniest bit of effort into a concept for re-using the technology with normal cars.
It allows a tiny car like a Leaf or Ignis to have the ability to tow I guess.
Might even be able to do it with a motorcycle as the lead vehicle so it's only your bike and your caravan on your trip, I would have loved it in my younger days touring on a supersport bike.
Well I doubt this can match the supersports acceleration ;) but I get what you mean.
It's actually interesting from a design standpoint. How do you handle a lead vehicle that has much better acceleration. Do you artificially slow down the lead vehicle so it can't abandon the "towed" trailer? What does the follower do when it loses the leader. This basically needs nearly fully autonomous driving.
Still no reason it should be wireless.
They could have a physically attached trailer with extra engine to allow those small cars to tow more than they are capable of.
Supplementing electric vehicles ability to tow? (I don't actually know this is just the only thing I could think of)
Just have three jacked trailers orbiting you like koopa shells
I'll take 'solutions for problems that don't exist ' for $500, Alex.
You, with your greasy hair, and Dago mustache...
Owning an EV that can't tow for any great distance is very much a problem that exists.
That's not a problem that a small machine like this will fix though. The problem with EVs towing isn't that they don't have enough power to tow, it's that the energy consumption goes up significantly due to changes in aerodynamics and the loss of regen braking. Petrol and diesel cars have the same problem, but can refuel quickly. EVs can't.
Now imagine an autonomous trailer drone behind your EV. It's most likely going to be electric, as most new automotive things are going to be electric by now. Then there are two options:
In the first case you might as well use your own EV to tow. In the second case you might as well just rent or buy a vehicle meant for towing. I don't see how the economics of it are going to make sense.
Ok...from where?
It's like...people just think of the worst fucking ideas that are possible to imagine...& other assholes KEEP GIVING THEM MONEY for the worst ideas possible. Is this real life?
bus enter the chat
"hey guys, I know yall hate me because poor people can use me but it seems like this whole self driving car thing isn't working out because it requires an absurd amount of new technology to work perfectly..... you know if you just put a moderate amount of money into me I could solve most mass transit problems right?"
mob of angry suburban karens swarm the bus, light it on fire and tip it over
Yes. See "Fyre Festival" for more examples.
Guarantee asshole drivers will try to squeeze into the space between car and trailer.
Solution is that the trailer will tailgate you all the time. It'll also flash its beams if you don't go 10mph above the limit.
Because of the millisecond reaction time of the powerful processor, there is no way this could go wrong.
I drive trucks pulling a set of double-trailers for a living and people already try to merge between my trailers. like yeah, the gaps too small and there's a converter dolly there already, but that doesn't seem to stop them from trying
People use "WiFi" as a generic term for wireless protocols all the time, this almost certainly doesn't use actual WiFi.
Eh, even If it does, it shouldn't be a problem. Relying on a wireless link that could fail due to interference or jamming for actual control would be Musk-level insane.
The hitchbot would need to be capable of visually following the lead vehicle, possibly using something like a big QR code for identification and tracking.
The wireless link could be for telemetry like range and non-critical controls like "stay here" and "start following".
If the link fails, you get a big warning to stop ASAP but the bot keeps following.
So... Ethernet?
Maybe, maybe not
Fascinating.
Yeah it would probably use IR
In Europe, where nobody fell for the lies of the car manufacturers that you would need a big fat truck just to tow a caravan, we just hang them legally and without issues to our cars.
LOL, just commented that I had a hitch installed for $175 on my 2002 convertible. Works great. I've towed trailers and small boats all over.
This would conceivably have a much higher rating than your convertible though.
This is pure poetry, with steady crescendo!
I turned my laptop on this afternoon and my wifi couldn't connect because my laptop couldn't find my wifi network.
Took two goes.
So now imagine you are driving at seventy miles an hour down the motorway, and your car loses contact with your cararvan.........
I've been battling Wi-Fi issues with my soundbar for a week now and because Wi-Fi won't work properly it's struggling to remember that it's supposed to turn on with the TV...
The worst part is it wasn't an issue with the ISP at my old place so I'm close to the point where I'll have to go and buy a rooter to bypass their Wi-Fi...
TL;DR: Wi-Fi towing is fucking moronic.
Yeah WiFi is kinda known to be the opposite of the namesake of your instance
And then there's a turn ahead.
You can only watch helplessly as your WiFi enabled caravan drives straight into Dairy Queen.
"where nothing can possiblie go wrong. I mean, possibly go wrong. That's the first time something has gone wrong..."
When you get to hell, tell them Itchy sent you!
"All right kids, remember where we parked the car parked itself"
What about wifi jammers?
One asshole with a radio jammer targeting WiFi bands will cause an accident. This could be exploitable by nation state actors in specific scenarios if this gained popularity. Bad bad idea and should be discouraged. Towing should be physical-driven with interconnecting hardware.
I fail to see the usecase in "hitchless towing". Anyone any idea?
I agree. Changing the oil through wi-fi on the other hand, that sounds neat
I guess if you have a sedan or small car that doesn't have a hitch? But if you have a trailer you probably have a vehicle to tow it.
If the towed vehicle moves on its own power, you need less force from the towing car.
Yes, removing the need to buy a huge truck because you tow an RV a few times a year.
This also just seems to be a stepping stone technology for semi truck caravans as well. I can see a scenario with a 'pilot truck' that has a few people in it guiding a 20 + long caravan of trailers. Allows for semi autonomous behavior while still having people there to address the occasional problems.
The only benefit of the tech required I can imagine would be to allow the computer to reverse the controls of the trailer when reversing the car (like video game flight sticks can) so that the human doesn't have to process reversing their trailer any differently than they normally in the vehicle.
It would also eliminate the hitch from the vehicle, so there would be no vehicle stress from towing.
This could all be done and still have a physical connection to the truck as a failsafe.
The other thing that springs to mind is you could use a little commuter car with this, so you don't have to drive a big F350 all the time just because you tow sometimes.
Why this is better than having a truck and a small car, and only using the truck when you need it, I don't know.
I would like it if everything I did went without a hitch.
🥁
Ok, but WiFi connection isn't strong enough so how about connecting them by a cable, which transports the data...
I love this idea. We could use a rigid metal that conducts sound waves. Steel maybe?
As for the data cable, we would need something to control the taillights, so I'm thinking just a basic set up with copper wire wrapped in an insulator?
This is so crazy it might just work.
You people are utterly convinced you're enlightened geniuses that have figured it all out, aren't you?
The use case for this is vehicles that are lacking the range or towing capacity for the trailer, allowing the driver to own a small, efficient vehicle, and rent the tow bot a few times a year when they actually need it.
This has some real verification can vibes.
Future is going to be thrilling
Jeff is watching chaos ensure on the highway. 3 seconds have passed since he turned on his long-range WiFi Jammer.
Wardriving is back on the menu (don't know that it ever left but feel like it fell out of notice)
Eh, a year and a half ago I caught a guy on a bike using a brute force car opener up and down a street near the job site I was on. Basically the device spits out every key fob door open code on a list until the car opens, or possibly it goes through known permutations used by various companies. What I know for sure is he had a small laptop and a USB antenna and was stopping at every car for a few minutes opening the ones he got, and moving on from the ones he didn't. Caught a decent video of his face and what he was doing for the police before he made off on his bike.
A hitch is a few hundred dollars and a few hours of work. This is going to be a few thousand dollars. Who would use this?
Few thousand? You basically have to buy most of an entire car as your hitch, including the most expensive parts like the engine or the motor and battery. This will be a few tens of thousands of dollars.
Yeah, the additional cost to get that towing ability is nothing to sniff at, and it narrows down your vehicle choices a lot.
Nah! I had the local U-Haul place put a hitch on my 2002 Spyder (Mitsubishi Eclipse) for $175, including wiring. Towed my boat around a bit, but not advisable!
Still, I can hook my trailers to it and tow stuff all over. Just have a look at the tow capacity for your vehicle and don't go nuts.
I mean, it has a valid use case - you have a car with no towing capacity, like a sports car, and you have a caravan that you use a couple times a year for vacation or whatever. Normally you'd need to own a truck as well, or instead of the sports car daily a truck for the few times you actually need it. With this thing, you could "haul" your caravan with anything, and then when you get to your camp site or whatever you'd have your normal car to drive around at the location with. Shit, you could ride a motorcycle to your campsite with your caravan following you, that would be cool as hell.
But you have the obvious safety and security issues and potential for technical malfunctions, all of which would be super dangerous with no second layer of protection. You have the issue of leaving your caravan behind at the site while you drive your car to the shop and your shit getting stolen. You have a second power train to worry about and a second vehicle to maintain and fuel (or in this case charge, which might take a minute, especially if you are also driving an EV with it, then you've got 2 EV's to charge at each stop).
But the obvious man.....if the software tether fails, or freezes, or locks up, or has any kind of issue, somebody is gonna die. It will never, ever get approved.
People who own cars with a low tow rating, or poor range.
That what future piracy looks like
Lmao no way this thing ever actually gets made/approved
It seems like an extremely silly middle-ground solution between traditional hitch loads and self-driving trucks. If this somehow took off, I'm sure the general public would more quickly accept self-driving trucks. But I can't see why anybody would look at this solution and think it's a good idea.
Using Wi-Fi for this seems like a really weird choice. I'd think the better per option would be something like low energy Bluetooth.
Not sure if satire or not...
I haven't read the patent, but I'd bet my shiniest quarter that the phrase "in one or more embodiments" (or the equivalent) shows up.
When you write a patent application, you usually try to cover as many use cases as possible. But you also can't be too vague or abstract. So you provide an "embodiment" to show how it works, typically using existing technology. Then you clarify the broad cases--so in this embodiment they use wifi, but could use other secure, high-bandwidth wireless protocols.
this concept is so stupid on so many levels lmao
rather they should make "smart" trailers that can disconnect and brake before an accident or something. and hitches with extra batteries (since towing hogs EV range like a mofo)
Millions of trailers already exist, this is an easy way to add towing assist to those trailers without having to go buy a brand new one.
You're forgetting that this little thing is an entire car, and it'll cost accordingly
Jam the wifi signal
Hiro Protagonist vibes :)
Snow Crash is amazing.
How long til "them damn kids" are slinging themselves along by hitching magnetic grappling hooks to armored pizza delivery vehicles? Lol
That satisfying thwunk as the poon lands on steel
Some you have no idea about IT security and it shows.
Why.....
...so you don't need a truck, very obviously.
Considering there are still small areas of my hometown where service will drop when out in the middle of the road and only for a very short section, I wouldn't want a wi-fi connected hitch vehicle thing.
Damn there's a lot of people here complaining about innovation.
Here's a quick tip, if you can think in 10 seconds a problem with this, the engineers that work on these projects for YEARS probably already thought of it.
1 - Yes, wireless isn't 100% reliable, so they are going to need more than one backup system. With a data connection between the trailer and the car, you have MANY ways to alert the driver that there's a problem, AND your trailer has a processor that can safely handle problems. Heck, a VERY easy fix is to just keep a camera pointed at the license plate and keep it centered in the view while flashing a thing on the dashboard that the trailer isn't working correct and you need to pull over. Worst case the trailer detects a problem and slows to a stop with the emergency flashers on, but even that would only be needed if several other options failed.
2 - People bitch all the time about Giant Dually Trucks(tm) that are just used for daily driving. Well, pulling trailers on the weekend is why a lot of people have the excuse for this. If we can eliminate the need for the heavy tow vehicle, then you can just drive a small sedan and still be able to go glamping on the weekends.
3 - There are MILLIONS of travel trailers out there right now. If we switch to small EVs overnight, we can either landfill all those trailers, or figure out a way to retrofit them to still be useful.
4 - Encryption is a thing. If this is using current, modern Wi-Fi, then you can be pretty damn sure that nobody is going to hack into that connection.
Sure, companies cut corners and cheap out of things all the time, but this is absolutely possible to do right, and solves an actual problem.
As someone who's observed the process for these patents, typically the company just patents anything it thinks it can, regardless of whether or not the idea is practical or if they have any interest in bringing it to market. It doesn't even need to relate to their core business. Just cause they filed a patent, does not mean they spent any time determining if it was a good idea. Someday one of these crazy patents might prove valuable so they want as many as they can.
Yeah, and some countries (like the US) are all about first-to-file, which means that even if someone thought of something first (with documentation to prove it), if a second party files for a patent first, they'll get it. So it's better to file and not use it than to hold onto it.
The engineers do their best, then management gets to it.
Also a corporate engineer. I put faith in corporations wanting to avoid lawsuits. Assuming you don't have an insane billionaire calling the shots, the suits will make sure things are as safe as they need to be to avoid losing money.
Touchscreens in cars are a great example of this. It's not a safety-critical component (like steering or brakes). The negative safety impact can be argued away in court. So the suits give touchscreens the a-okay. But if there's a hint of a problem with steering, braking, or ECM, management will be in full support of a proper fix.
Not that they'd manage to avoid messing up wireless towing, but as long as there's financial incentive in doing things right, management will fight for it.
Here’s a quick tip, if you can think in 10 seconds a problem with this, the engineers that work on these projects for YEARS probably already thought of it.
Then why do so many cars have fucking touchscreen infotainment systems?
A processor that can safely handle problems on the road does not exist. And if a pseudo trailer exists with it and a drive train, it's just an autonomous electric car. Buying two electric cars will not be price competitive with buying a larger vehicle for cargo/towing capacity, especially considering the additional hassle on the user (have to store two expensive vehicles, have to set up a pseudo tow between the two anytime you think you might need the capacity). So people will still buy large vehicles, there definitely won't be a switch "overnight". Besides, most of them already are bought based on an overstated/oversold need, making the purchase less rational will have a marginal, but not sea-changing, impact on buying habits. Encryption is good, but plenty of companies and individuals get hacked today, it will stop the vast majority of attack vectors but the idea of it stopping all attack vectors is borderline laughable. Why is landfilling trailers a positive thing? Preemptively replacing gear that is perfectly operational is part of the toxic consumerism cycle that has put our environment in this mess.
Speaking as an engineer, we may think about the best solution to a problem for years, but that doesn't mean we are solving the right problem
2 - People bitch all the time about Giant Dually Trucks™ that are just used for daily driving. Well, pulling trailers on the weekend is why a lot of people have the excuse for this. If we can eliminate the need for the heavy tow vehicle, then you can just drive a small sedan and still be able to go glamping on the weekends.
How do you think this 'little towing-robot-car thing' is going to tow, steer and break a heavy trailer safely on the highway?
It got to be heavy for itself, needs a big battery pack, powerful motor... It's basically got to be an F150 itself. Nice if you don't need daily drive it, but it cost almost as much and won't actually be very environment-friendly either I assume.
The brakes are part of the trailer. I'd imagine laws are different everywhere, but where I'm at trailer brakes are required for 3000+ pound trailers, though it's a bit more complicated than that and even a 1500 pound trailer could require them.
Anyway, the point is that big 5th wheel travel trailers are way heavier than even a huge dually truck. A 7,000 pound truck can tow a 25,000 pound trailer. I'd imagine the towbot would be limited to something a bit more sane, like 6,000 pounds (class 3 hitch). Since the towbot doesn't also have to carry passengers etc, I'd imagine 1,500 to 2,000 pounds for it.
I would buy this, assuming it's reliable over an f150 in a heart beat. If they can actually get it working reliably they will print money. I'd easily drop 15k on something like this. Fuck you can even share the cost between family members and friends.
Ahem, possiblEE go wrong. That's the first... thing... that's, ever gone wrong.
This is a fantastic idea. If they get it working reliably and it can tow 12k , the 1/2 ton pickup market is in for a rude awakening.
Their market is not people who tow stuff.
🤷♂️ their loss
My question is, "Why?"
Most of the time, including in the picture from this article, people would be towing something like a camper. To go camping. In a remote area. Which has no WiFi to begin with.
For generations, a hitch has been a sufficient tool for towing shit. I guess its simplicity just doesn't allow enough avenues to monopolize from. I can't possibly think of how Wi-Fi towing solves more problems than it causes, other than charging the consumer for shit they don't actually need.
Wi-Fi is just a wireless protocol. You PROBABLY don't connect to a stationary wifi access point that is a relay to the wider internet, you are probably using a wifi connection from the towing device to an access point in the tow vehicle that's tied into the CAN bus of the towing vehicle to relay things like position, speed, breaking, road conditions, etc.
You could pretty easily do this all with a local LAN without needing any external Internet access.
It's called Ad-hoc WiFi. This is how almost all dash cams work these days. They are the access point you connect to. You then use whatever app required to view the videos on it. This is how the trailer would work for control.
In a remote area. Which has no WiFi to begin with.
You mean cellular service, it has no cellular service. Wi-Fi is a communications protocol for communicating over short distances.
It's the router that generates the Wi-Fi.
The theoretical use case is for cars without the capacity to tow. Either due to engine power, or lack of a tow ball. Effectively, it's a small, self driving vehicle, that can tow. It just follows close behind your care, and so needs far less in the way of navigation capabilities.
It's a stupidly small niche however. Anyone who could justify and afford one could do far better just by hiring a driver and tow vehicle.
I mean, if the problem is lack of power, so the tow vehicle has it's own motor, couldn't you just have the same tow vehicle setup connected to the back of the car, using it's motor to cancel out the extra load on the main vehicle without a potentially risky wireless connection?
That's not even mentioning that you can get hitch receivers that you attach to just about every car out there. Hell even back in the 50s it was common place to see a sedan with a tow hitch. Unless you're driving a car that struggles to carry itself up a hill the only thing stopping you from putting a hitch on a Prius or Challenger is your willingness to buy a receiver hitch and bolt it to the frame.
I tow a lot with an EV and when towing my miles per kWh halve.
For EVs this fixes this range problem as you are no longer towing. Improving range while towing is important for people who tow a lot with EVs becoming more prevalent.
However you now have to charge the trailer and the car, which is a right pain.
Plus relying on wireless connection is just massively dumb.
There are trailers coming that conventionally hitch and have their own motor and battery. This improves range but now your trailer is massively heavier, more expensive, and requires its own charging.
Majority of EV public chargers are just not setup for pull through charging so you have to unhitch. Just painful even with motormovers to move the trailer off the car.
We should be working to reduce drag as this is the biggest issue for the trailer at motorway speeds, and then weight.
WiFi just means "wireless" now, people call all kinds of wireless stuff "WiFi" when it has nothing to do with the protocol at all, like smoke detectors.
Maybe it works with Bluetooth, everything is better with Bluetooth, even WIFI
I was interested to discover that Android Auto will make Bluetooth and WiFi connections to your phone, just to be able to send and receive on both at the same time.
I wonder what the breakdown is, it probably wouldn't separate audio packets across protocols, maybe one gets relegated to instructions and metadata and the other is dedicated to audio? Or along service lines with different throughput requirements, like Maps on one and Spotify on the other? Or heck, maybe one is just for handshakes to establish the other.
Bluetooth does seem fine for handling audio, and at handling many devices simultaneously, so neither of those seem like good candidates for pulling WiFi in.
I could just look this up but I'm enjoying thinking about it.
So I don't need a truck to tow. Wi-Fi will be car to device, a self contained network.
I mean, all you need to steal a trailer today is a pair of bolt cutters, so it's not really less secure than that.
It's a bit harder to use those bolt cutters while the vehicles are moving though
Skill issue
I like that we’ve collectively agreed on the idea that Tesla’s driving AI will detect and target children.
Not most children, but if a rich shareholder needs a transplant, the car has a database of matching people who are organ donors or who's parents believe in organ donation and will make subtle attempts to accidentally run them over. (A joke but fuck it maybe not at this point)
This is the worst timeline.
This is getting really dystopian sci-fi