10 lessons for stronger movements

Whoever coined the phrase "it's not my job to educate you" is top of my rogues gallery. If you want democracy to succeed, it is literally your job to educate everyone you can about the things you are passionate about and the changes you wish to see. I get where it came from, I understand the feeling, but it's the worst possible phrase in the context of trying to make a political change.

“It’s not my job to educate you” led to Prager University
- If you don't, someone else will.
- It really didn't. Maybe 10 people said it because they were being harassed by concern trolls, while the rest of us continued to engage in conversation with people who seemed like they might genuinely be confused.
  Like literally just do a web search for your question and you will be on better footing when you ask it.
  Like I felt offended the first time I heard "my culture is not a costume" but I actually did some reading / thinking before I started bothering people with questions like what??? or even banditos?? or what about mummies?
I feel like a lot of progressive vocabulary words get used outside the contexts where they apply.
"It's not my job to educate you" is a fair and valid thing to say when someone demands you defend the validity of your identity while you're just trying to live your life. It's unreasonable to expect every trans person to explain the history and complexity of gender to every chud who gives them shit.
It is, however, the opposite of activism and super unhelpful for an activist to say while ostensibly trying to build a movement.
Similarly, "mansplaining" is not a blanket term for any man explaining anything, listening to a friend vent is not "emotional labor", and participating in cultures other than the one you grew up in is not "cultural appropriation". All real terms that point at real problems, all sometimes used outside the contexts in which they are helpful.
- Gaslighting is another often misused term. It's not just a blanket term for lying, it is a specific type of lie.
Yeah I mean I can understand not everyone wants to be an educator, especially of more ignorant people but when people say this I do wonder why they are even talking. I usually speak to people because I am interested in learning from them or because they’re interested in learning from me. This is the purpose of human communication. If you aren’t interested then the obvious solution is to stay silent.
- When out distributing political flyers people will often come up to me pretending to want a conversation and learn something about my/our points, but just talk over me all the time. Their purpose is not to listen, or to learn, or to question, but just to feel like they matter.
  Had a guy recently tell me about how he is a mechanic and that he did his own study where he found out that combustion engines do not, in fact, let out any CO2. He started it all with "give me 3 reasons to vote for you" to put me on the spot, then immediately was like "ok, I have 3 not to do it."
  There is no conversation with people like that, I've tried it often. Now I just wish them a nice day and go away as it's not my job to waste time trying go educate them talking against an idiot wall.
- I can understand not everyone wants to be an educator, especially of more ignorant people but when people say this I do wonder why they are even talking.
  Exactly. If you're not willing to try and educate someone you disagree with, insulting them is no substitute (in fact it's pretty much the worst course of action re the presumed desired result), just keep quiet, or alternatively go talk to others who already agree with you so you can stroke each other's egos, lol.
You need to educate the right people at the right times, more than anything. I swear both this original message and most of the replies to it, like this one, speak of wild levels of inexperience in how to socialize and make people unite with you.
If you can choose between spending your energy addressing the stupid, ill-informed ideas posted by liberal Americans on Facebook or Reddit and withstanding a little public trolling, or spending your energy "educating" a vocal, prominent leftist who makes content about something they're doing wrong or some word they're misusing or some marginalized group they might be offending, can you guess what's going to help the cause more?
(The really sad part here is that some people are reading this trying to weigh both options.)
- It's not exactly the sentiment I have a problem with. There are definitely people who aren't worth engaging with and there's a time to walk away, as someone else in this thread pointed out they do. Responding in a kind of snarky, condescending tone rather than just walking away does not help you.
  Think about an online thread where this happens: Someone is making an argument, and a troll appears. They engage for a bit, but realize they aren't going to make any progress. Walking away let's the thread die, and people who stumble upon it in the future will likely recognize the troll for what they are and consider the argument. Responding with condescension instead makes the person appear to only be arguing for self-aggrandizement rather than to actually help or improve anything, and it can poison the argument they made before. It plays right into the troll's hands.
I first started seeing this on reddit (who knows where it actually came from though) which I believe schools its users to want to say SOMETHING, ANYTHING for attention and engagement. I agreed with or rather understood its meaning at one point but this phrase along with has "let me Google that for you" has fostered an abysmal internet culture. I think a much more servicable and sympathetic version of what this phrase was once trying to say, when said in good faith, should be "its not my responsibility to engage with this post right now", which isn't spoken aloud but is applicable to everyone online, and which I find myself thinking more and more when a comment makes me groan. The problem is how driven we all are to say SOMETHING, ANYTHING for attention amd engagement. I think it was a valuable realization at the time that felt so good to fire off uncritically on Twitter that people really hurt themselves, others, and the internet's culture when they did.

This for everytime some one suggests an idea. It's not your job to snipe it because it's too lofty an idea. If it's a good idea, help hold it up.

And little victories. Healing by ten thousand stitches.

Wish we wouldnt use AI

yeah the identical styles get old real fast
- Its also the weapon of the enemy.
Perfection is the enemy of progress. Way to derail <3
- It was a critique, not a tear down.
- This is like talking about awareness and then driving away in a Tesla. The people who are feasting upon our institutions made AI. The same people we are protesting that infested this regime.
- Treating criticism like an attack is the enemy of progress, and ironically more perfectionist than being able to acknowledge flaws in your messaging too.
- There are always the snobs that prefer nobody else be doing shit either so they can feel even more superior.
Where’s AI? Is the whole image AI or just the art?
- The whole image.
Is this critiquing to build or tear down?
- Critique. This wouldnt have been hard to make in a presentable way without AI. I get it, I'm just saying now is the time to burn all bridges. Change is coming either way.
It’s distasteful, but a useful weapon. We need ways to create content that is good enough and really fast to make. A grassroots movement doesn’t have the funds to pay marketing teams to do our work for us.
- What did people do before AI? It wasn't that long ago.
- AI is being used every social media site the world over to hamper discourse, embroil people, to enrage people...
  I don't know of another way to combat it except with more AI. Maybe at some point people will completely get off of the internet with the thought "There's no real people on the internet any more".

Like the Muslim voters in Michigan that voted for Trump because they didn't like Harris' support of Israel and then immediately had ICE breathing down their necks

This is true, but it's a good reminder that most people don't act like this meme. We should remember that minorities don't owe us their vote, and we should stand up for them
- As a transwoman I'm suddenly used to abuse from false allies who see me as an "Guaranteed Vote"
  They're not wrong, but only because it's a two-party system and a true enemy is worse than a false friend.
Yes, this is the attitude they are referring to.
Right? Like, if someone's promising Free Grog and Good Times, they're probably LeChuck in disguise.
Yes, I made an Escape From Monkey Island reference.
First time I played that game, I felt stupid for not realizing the guy named "Charles L. Charles" with the same voice actor as LeChuck, was in fact, LeChuck.
- Maaaan now i got spoilered for a game that came out many many many years ago! Thaaanks!!! Angry emoji, angry emoji
- I have no idea what you are talking about, but I'm glad that you are here and having a good time.
- Wow! This is the second best Monkey Island reference I've ever seen!
Exactly. If you don't want to be deported, you're going to have to be okay with genociding some folks.
- Or they could have voted for Harris and not had to deal with mass deportations and then tried to stop the genocidal acts. Instead they voted to continue the genocidal acts AND get deported. If the problem persists either way, why vote to fuck yourself twice?

WhY Do YoU SuPpOrT GeNoCiDe?

It's an unfortunate but necessary genocide
Edit: I don't support it!! But at this point it's pretty clear it's necessary, no? As liberals we need to be honest with ourselves at least.
- i guess you need to spell out for me exactly how wiping out an entire culture of innocent human beings in cold blood is "necessary"
  idk if you're just trolling for attention but saying shit like that and calling it "unfortunate"... dude wtf
- This comment was reported. It does not violate our rules. Downvotes are appropriate here, convincing arguments even more so. Carry on.
- I'll bite. What do we as liberals get out of this genocide? Are you gonna say our stock in Lockheed will go up? Because not all of us liberals have stock in Lockheed.

Also, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

Never forget that even though we knew that Stalin was a vicious mass murderer of his own people, we allied with him to defeat Hitler, and it is highly unlikely that we could have done it without out them, or at least it would have taken us far longer, and cost many more lives.

We turned on each other the moment the war was over, but at least we could agree to put aside our differences for the time being.

It is likely that when it comes time to finally put down the rabid dog named MAGA once and for all, it is going to require allying with the Traditional GOP. I despise them with everything I have, and will want accountability when this is over, but if they are willing to assist us in purging MAGA from society, we are going to have to hold our noses and accept their help.

It is likely that when it comes time to finally put down the rabid dog named MAGA once and for all, it is going to require allying with the Traditional GOP.
Kamala tried that, it lead to Leftists not voting for Kamala Harris because they no longer saw a difference between her and Trump, and Rightists didn't vote for Kamala Harris because even the "Never-Trumper" faction of the party gets in line behind whoever the GOP tells them to. Because Republicans have something Democrats will never have, unquestionable brand loyalty.
MAGA will be not be defeated by cooperating with Conservatives who fear that they "Must defeat Trump to save the party", this is because Conservatives do not have an ideology, they have a tribe, and their tribe must always win or their Gods will hold them accountable.
If Conservatives turn against MAGA, it will be because they've been directly targeted by MAGA and are looking for a way out, and by the time that happens it'll already be too late. "No one left to speak for me" as the poem goes.
That said, the Right Wing portion of the Supreme Court is turning against Trump for this exact reason, they realize that if they don't he will just get rid of the Supreme Court and rule directly.
If "The TRUE Republicans" wanted to work with us to destroy Trumpism, I'd gladly accept their help, but they will NEVER work against the tribe.
There is no substantive difference between "MAGA" and the traditional GOP.
- LMAO the "traditional GOP" was killed by MAGA.
Personally, I think Free America and the Allies would be teaming up with the Mexican Cartels. If anyone can terrorize the Trump Regime, it would be them. IMO, it wouldn't be surprising if Mexico and the Allies promise to give away Texas to the Cartels as a spoil of war.
- teaming with what might as well be classified as terrorists, and literal drug trafficking cartels is kind of insane not gonna lie.

That sounds like something an enemy would say, right before they disagree with my objectively correct opinion about some minor thing and reveal their true nature.

I feel personally attacked by your vague statement and therefore see you as an enemy for life
the importance of that relatively minor thing also matters though, we can't just purity test everybody for everything, even if it's objectively correct, not all of it matters.
I would rather lose all my rights than stand beside ten thousand men who think neopronouns are cringe.
- It would be impossible to achieve real change without your rigidity. Thank you.

However, you have to be careful that your movement doesn't get infiltrated, because that will hurt your movement. You have to be careful who you are walking with, and what their end goals are.

Don't protest for a better health care system with people that are antiscientific. Don't protest for a free Palestine together with antisemitic people. Do not let them blur your message.

One thing I've been grappling with is I would completely support a violent overthrow of the Trump admin, as I don't consider him legitimate because of the insurrection clause, but I would never ever even discuss the subject with a bunch of tankies or anarchists because they're just supporting destruction of our protected rights all the same as the enemy.

Imperfect Allies Aren't Enemies
Critique to build, not tear down
Organize, don't just argue
Movements win, not individuals
Perfection is the enemy of progress
Ego kills movements
Plan for the long game
Meet people where they are
Power doesn't care about feelings
Division is a weapon used by elites, don't play along

Thank you for annotating the post. Bumping engagement with my comment.
Thank you!
OP, accessibility is important. Don't provide images of text when there's real text. If you insist on the image, then provide alt text. You only limit reach with just an image & mark your message as exclusionary, contrary to your goals.

Leftist broadly have gotten used to attacking their own side because they're not the angry, mindless orcs that the right nurtures, and thus it's simply easier to police your own side and win arguments against other people with minds than try to butt heads against orcs who don't care and have no interest in thoughtful conversation.
It feels like action, it feels like some kind of accomplishment that you got some progressive content creator railroaded off the internet because they had a dumb take on israel once or used the R slur at some point.
- It feels like action, it feels like some kind of accomplishment that you got some progressive content creator railroaded off the internet because they had a dumb take on israel once or used the R slur at some point.
  that's great, but does it actually accomplish anything? That's what really matters, it doesn't matter if you run some weirdo out of town because he moderately disagrees with you, if he just goes to the next town over, where more people are waiting for him...

Dear 50501 folks,

Every so often I check my messages at Facebook and noted there’s a big 50501 group there… any chance you could get that group to start educating their Facebook members that supporting Facebook means supporting the coup and fascism?

Just a thought, Wwe

I get what you're saying, but if we sequester ourselves to niche spaces, how can we spread information? Isn't it important to reach Facebook users?
- What you do is underground railroad them out of Facebook.
Using Facebook to attract disgruntled hostiles who are potentially ripe for recruitment, or those who are politically agnostic and getting angry at what is happening to them, and poisoning one of their primary propganda mouthpieces, are all important missions.
- Breaking through to them is something I have tried to do for years. I’ve stumbled up on this:
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/10KqzL0M2QzUTCdTFzcA1sRkfbNdCoaL7Xn4n4ilpwi8/edit?usp=drivesdk
  Comments if you have them.
The coup? Who is overthrowing what exactly? I seriously just dont understand these things. I can't imagine it's very legit if there hasn't been a call to arms. That's why we bear arms, right? For perhaps an attempted coup.
- Please read this:
  https://allr.cat/a-strange-stain-in-the-sky/

ITT: A demonstration of the precise behavior OP is trying to warn against.

yeah. There's a difference between (for example) a transphobe screaming at you, and someone who doesn't fully understand all the terms but supports you being yourself. People in the comments are thinking it's more of the former than the ladder.

I'd be more likely to listen if this weren't next to an AI Gen otter

Another sepia toned AI comic.
yeah, it just cheapens the message heavily
Yea I haven't even read the message, the second I saw the text wobble I came to the comments to see who else has already called it out.
- "Critique to build, not tear down"
"Perfection is the enemy of progress"
- "Division is a weapon used by elites"
  uses currently divisive technology popularly known to be made by elites
  I hope this unnecessary choice doesn't cheapen my message or bother people I'm trying to meet where they are.

I really wish my fellow "progressives" would get it through their heads how deeply true it is that perfection is the enemy of progress. It's supremely ironic that so many people who say they value freedom and individuality are so ABSOLUTELY intolerant of any slight deviations from what they see as moral perfection and adherence to doctrines. It's like you're either a hundred percent right or ten thousand percent wrong, and even suggesting there can be an in-between is being "complicit". Lighten the fuck up or we'll never get anywhere.

The incessant purity testing is completely exhausting and aggravatingly frustrating.

Neoliberals will not allow meaningful change to happen

look man, you and i both hate the current trump admin ok, let's start there, and work on what we agree upon, and then we diverge when we get past that point.
- Here's the deal this election.
  The leftists control the new leadership and the Neoliberals get in line to support us.
  The Neoliberals have had too much of a say and 50 years of them in control of the Democratic party have turned it soft and corporatist. Meeting in the middle with fascists has only brought us closer to fascism.
  You can get with the movement or get out of the way.
- Right? I hate Neo Liberals to, but the thing is, we don't have the luxury of combatting Status Quo, we are in the unenviable position of trying to hold onto the corrupt status quo because the alternative is demonstrably and unspeakably worse.

This is 100% something a few people here on Lemmy need to see.

You mean Lemmy, the website that has the broad and diverse userbase who primarily lean far-left to even-further-left? Everyone is here exactly so they can fight with people who aren't on the right and can be debated with or attacked without a frustrating, pointless argument with someone who can't even read.
Nobody here is going to read this as anything other than "You need to go after the REAL disguised nazis in your midst!" Everyone is here to escape having to fight orcs, so people here fight each other.
edit: keep downvoting.... or if you rather spend your energy on something educational to yourself, challenge yourself to find a single contentious thread or post here that isn't niche groups of leftists thought-clashing with each other about who's a better leftist. I'm not saying you're all bad, I'm saying you're all making a lot of mistakes which is why we get trounced constantly and we now have a fucking dictator undoing democracy. We are not victims here, we are failures. Get better. I know it sucks to hear, but if you feel called out, you're definitely the target and I hope you feel great levels of shame and accountability.
I have never been more disgusted with my own side as I have in the last few years, and you're still the best bet in town, if you could just get your fucking emotions under control.
Its something people should have seen and accepted on or before November 5th.
Now I kind of just want to see the anti-electoralists suffer. Even if it means I suffer.

looks around the thread

I don't know why you felt the need to make a message like this, OP. We're all fully united and never quibble over inconsequential shit.

In this essay, I will outline how your post actually SUPPORTS the patriarchy…
FOUND THE NAZI

10 lessons for stronger Christians

Even works

More fiber? What kind of movements are we talking about?

Smart.

Smart smart smart.

People on lemmy retort stuff like this with "If you talk to a nazi, you ARE a nazi".

Meanwhile it's just some dude who likes sourdough.

Honestly we have more in common than we think - on the left we just happen to "eat our own" so to speak.

Nah dude, if you tolerate fascists in any space, they use that space to recruit and try to transform the space for their needs. I've heard this from renfaire folks, who had to drive the fascists out of the space to keep it sane. I've heard about this happening in work places too. You gotta organize with non-fascists and drive the fascists out of the space by being vocally and actively supportive of groups they despise.
- Want to know what the single biggest recruiting tool Nazis use, that nobody seems to ever talk about? Prison.
  I've seen normal, non-bigoted people end up getting busted for a minor drug charge or something stupid, then they go to prison, get their heads filled with racist crap, and then come out sieg-heiling Nazis.
  Prison is basically a Nazi-making factory at this point, so why does nobody ever talk about this?
- I agree with this. If you've ever worked with someone that was awesome to work with and the whole space was left empty when they moved to another company, than you've experienced the opposite of a nazi. One toxic, shitty dude can make the whole place go down the toilet. It really only takes one to change a place.
Did we already forget the almost overnight shift in what was seen as acceptable discourse once Trump won in 2016? All these intolerant and hateful assholes crawled out and felt emboldened to chirp christofascist/racist/delusional conspiracies in public and online spaces. And that zeitgeist shift pulled the Overton Window sharply to the right, paving the road for our current situation.
If someone’s basic political ideology is “government should industrialize state murder of X group/s” they are not someone I can make common cause or find sympathetic arguments with, or not without a lot of cult de-programming first.
- Okay but if your options are more murder and less murder then you shouldn't feel good about refusing to participate.
No, it's not about simply talking to a nazi. It's about engaging withvthem as if they are an honest actor. IF they are a true nazi (BIG 'if' with how utterly ignorant Americans are), they will only use your honest engagement to at best waste your time, and at worst further spread their hateful propaganda.
If you're engaging with an actual nazi/far right dingdong, this holds true. If you're engaging with some idiot who has only up to now heard nazi talking points, it is not true. It is about providing a platform for nazis, not about talking to idiots.
- True. In addition to that it's close to far-right rhetoric. I'm not saying whether it's correct or wrong... But they sure like to play victim and say people will label them a nazi if they talk about subjects or to certain people. And they're being wronged.
- And it gets complicated, because bad actors use this to make spaces for cult behaviour.
  Not just nazi specifically, but if you have spammers/bots you can effectively destroy any moderately nuanced progressive space by adding intentional offensive voices in the group, and at reactive voices outside the group calling the original members x/y and pointing at the bots in the group as evidence. Progressive voices will leave to avoid the association, while actual bigots will hear that it is another space for them. By the end, it's like it was always a bigot space, and the original points and nuance never existed.
  Beware divisive propaganda, but also don't accept actual intentional bigots to invade a space. If they proudly wear their bigotry, let them know it's not socially tolerated. They are a cancer if enabled.
  If someone says they interact with a space to try and stop it from turning into a bigot space, maybe that's not actually your enemy.
  Been fighting cult building propaganda for two decades and now I'm just yelling that the emperor has no clothes. It makes me happy to see people at least engaging with the topic, without calling me a nazi for trying to stop the spread of Nazis.
  Also casual reminder that black Americans are Russia's biggest target. Self segregation is what they want, don't fall for divisive rhetoric. Be wary of real bigots, especially socially empowered ones. find people you can trust, and find solidarity. Don't feed the division between those who want to cooperate. Education, exposure, and communication are paramount.

Perfection is the enemy of progress

I keep hearing people say this meaning "We need to let Republicans kill trans people". It seems to be a thought terminating cliche to pull out against anyone further left than the speaker.

As a trans person, that absolutely isn't how I or other leftists in the spaces I'm in use this phrase. It means to avoid letting disagreement over method or end goal distract from a common cause. Just because a candidate doesn't run for my specific brand of leftism doesn't mean I won't support them over a neoliberal opponent.

Unsure how this is supposed to help my bowels but thanks for sharing anyway! /j

On a serious note, yeah, this has been tricky for me to learn and internalise. Especially when the topics are close to home.

power doesn't care about feelings

Does this mean that power has to be handled with care because it threatens feelings

or

does it mean that it's ok to ignore feelings when it is possible to increase power?

LGBT folks got their ears on? Listening?

I've never felt friendlier, closer to a group of people and felt so much "fuck you die in a fire not enough!"

I will never stand against you, but it sure as fuck is hard being a friend.

(IRL, no problem. But online? Jesus fucking Christ what purity testing assholes.)

Left wing groups in general tend to do a lot of purity testing online , offline is a whole different story... as a queer person it buggs me tf out of my mind that people do that
I have no idea what this is targeting... I've never encountered anything like what you're describing. What exactly are you conveying that is earning you criticism from the LGBTQ community?
- I'm not shalafi but for example Blahaj and 196 is notoriously trigger happy with bans. I got permanently banned from like 5 communities all at once there for having one very tame civil discussion about where the overlap between gay and trans begins and ends. They're also the most well known instance for defederations.
Those are probably straight people trying to convince everyone else of how much they believe in the cause

AI cancer

Also Neoliberals are controlled opposition who have been shrugging their shoulders for 50 years, they are complicit or impotent.

The more i read "neoliberal" in political movement discussions, the more i get the feeling its the new "slap this label on anything you dont fully agree with to disqualify them imedietly"-label
- Did you just "everyone I don't like is a nazi" me?
  Words have meaning dummy
  Neoliberals differ from leftists because Neoliberalism depends on maintaining the status quo and appealing to Capital, which is not helpful when we need to redistribute wealth.

you got'er otter

Ok, but why an otter?

They’re fuckin rad.

Sadly, I keep trying to explain this to tankies, but they insisted NOT voting for Kamala because she wasn't going to use the Dragon Balls to bring back every Palestinian killed by Israel was a power move...

Anyway, that's how Donald Trump got re-elected

Amazing that you think this post is promoting punching leftwards in support of electionism
You're right. We liberals saw that Kamala and Biden did only the bare minimum genocide necessary. It's better than the extreme amounts of genocide trump is doing. Tankies often miss this point.
- sighs
  The point isn't that there's a magical "Correct Amount" of genocide that is acceptable.
  The point is that there is no magical solution that saves Palestine, there was however an option that made an already horrible scenario even worse, and that's the option we took in large part thanks to people who thought not voting would be good for anyone's health.
  Kamala may not have cared about the lives she was helping snuff out under Biden's watchful eye, but at least she wasn't outright planning to build a fucking resort atop the mass graves. (Trump Gaza ring any bells to you?)
  By the way, I'm a transwoman, I'm seeing ciswomen get awarded for "Standing up" against my kind, as my existence is being publically reframed as an affront to women's rights in what I can only imagine is the greatest dream TERF-kind ever had.
  This wouldn't be happening under Kamala.
  There are already states planning to illegalize "Gender Identity Fraud" in attempt to CRIMINALIZE MY VERY EXISTENCE
- Yep, it's sad, but the ~~Jews~~ Palestinians have to be eliminated for the good of the ~~Reich~~ Republic.
- "We liberals".
  Yeah right. Troll harder.

Any chance having source of this ? Thanks <3

It’s an AI slop hallucination. The source is thousands of hours of stolen labor.

"I can't vote for Harris! She was endorsed by Dick Cheney!"

By that logic, none of the people threatened by the Nazis should have accepted help from Imperialist England and racist USA.

People didn't vote for Harris because she was a colored woman, that's what voting patterns show
They just said it was because of Dick Cheney or Palestine
- Reminds me of this story.
  In 1980 they took a poll of people who had been eligible to vote in the 1960 election between John Kennedy and Richard Nixon. One of the questions they asked was 'who did you vote for in 1960?' In real life, the election was 51-49% a real squeaker. However, according to the poll, it was a 90-10% blow out for JFK.
- Exit polls said people mostly switched to Trump because of their concerns about grocery prices, which they attributed to the current president (Biden) and thought that Harris just represented more of Biden's policies.
  Exit polling is generally considered a little more viable because there's less "agenda" behind people's answers.
  All this said, the real culprit here was outside influence. Over the last decade or so there have been many foreign "troll farms" paid to flood American social media with accounts boosting the loudest, most outlandish takes on BOTH sides of every social issue. This is the KGB handbook for destabilizing democracies. Racism and sexism was part of it, but so was deliberate sabotage and efforts to boost racism and sexism in the US. Which we seem to fall for with ease.
  Once the general population can no longer tell what's real or not, once they can't figure out what side to take because everything is too hard to follow or too complex take a side on, they tune out. They stop getting involved. They hear a state-controlled news site (FOX, Rogan) give them a story and they shrug and accept it because they don't know the alternative.
  Nearly half of eligible voters didn't turn out last election, and I say again, this was by design.
  edit: user below has a history of getting banned across Lemmy, unsurprisingly, but if anyone is interested and not just here to be delusional and weird, they can look this up, election was sabotaged from many directions, if you can't handle talking about this problem, you have no business on the internet making statements. I can defend and discuss what I've learned with a cool head, can you?
  https://apnews.com/projects/election-results-2024/votecast/
Voting for a genocidal nazi to prevent another genocidal nazi is not how you stop genocidal nazis. This poster is not about electoralism, but addressing its inherent failure in any state wherein the discussion on genocide is not whether or not to do it, but to whom.
- Congratulations.
  You made the Gaza genocide worse, enabled Israel to attack more countries, screwed the people of Ukraine, and got mass deportations and attacks on transpeople in the USA.
  Keep telling me what a great job you did.
  Adults realize that sometimes there are no good choices, on bad ones and terrible ones.
It was an excuse to validate inaction. Nobody actually cared about the election anymore at this point because so many foreign agents have spent so many years just pouring tons of resources into amplifying both sides of our every social issue, no matter how silly or minor, until people stopped taking a position, people just tuned out because there didn't seem to be anyone reasonable, anywhere, and we all have to survive. There are just so many hours in the day for fact-checking, and a quarter of America is functionally illiterate anyway.
On some level people knew they were just checking out and throwing the game, so that's why they clung to so many weak, frankly fucking stupid arguments against Harris.
- Protest voters did not meaningfully impact the election.

Why did they choose a Rape Weasel as their mascot? Besides the adorableness of course.

"Imperfect Aliens" ok so only a "little" veiled racism is okay? Like in the good old days I guess.

Downvoted. This is how you get tankies in your movement. This is why they consistently show up to every fucking protest like they're welcome there. If we work with authoritarians to get rid of authoritarians, what's the point?

Huh, looks like this account got hijacked; it used to be a "tankie", then it went dark for a month and is now back doing literally nothing except ranting about tankies.
Exactly. The fallacy of this argument becomes perhaps more obvious to y'all left-leaning people when you consider that USA is an imperfect ally for a lot of the world right now.
Thats why tankies are quickly gaining control of every left movement. A left movement sadly always either gets taken over by tankies and then no one wants to do anything with them, respectfully, or they get "tamed" and turn into "social democrats" like the german SPD that holds left values only in writing but not in action
- If you're going around complaining about "tankies taking over movements", then you already ARE one of those tamed social democrats